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wilsontanws
03-15-2009, 10:44 PM
Hey guys out there!

Does anybody have any idea about the difference between the 3 university business courses?

How does the various modules for the respective uni varies?

Do we only declare our major after year 1 for all 3 uni?

Appreciate your comments! :)

wilsontanws
03-16-2009, 11:11 PM
Similarly to my other thread, i want to find out the differences between the business courses offered in all 3 uni.

For business courses, we only declare our major only after our first year in all 3 uni, am i right? Or is it true for some uni?

Lastly, does anybody know what does Human Resource(HR) does in a company?

If i remember correctly, according to ranking, NTU has a higher ranker compared to NUS. Is that correct?

Advice needed. Thanks. :)

xumbie
03-18-2009, 07:41 PM
Similarly to my other thread, i want to find out the differences between the business courses offered in all 3 uni.

For business courses, we only declare our major only after our first year in all 3 uni, am i right? Or is it true for some uni?

Lastly, does anybody know what does Human Resource(HR) does in a company?

If i remember correctly, according to ranking, NTU has a higher ranker compared to NUS. Is that correct?

Advice needed. Thanks. :)

HR - basically payroll, trainings, strategic planning such as how to retain talent, recruit talents (such as scholars for their scholarships). Also to communicate with the staff with various company policies.. etc etc

eva
03-24-2009, 05:53 PM
For Nus, biz/accountancy course is 4 years while that in ntu is 3 years.

Does anyone know whether that means nus grads may get more exemptions in professional accountancy exams than ntu grads cos they study more? Or do nus grads just study more biz stuff that's not very relevant to the exams.

GSC1989
03-24-2009, 07:11 PM
They do not get more exemptions. However, would advise you to view the additional workload as learning additional stuff on top of the accounting-specific domain knowledge rather than "biz stuff that is not relevant to the exams".

Alex
04-02-2009, 11:22 AM
I sent your question to all 3 Unis. The best reply I got so far. :D


Global status (unless otherwise specified)
Financial Times MBA Rankings NUS:35th NTU:24th SMU:Not ranked

Financial Times EMBA Rankings NUS:20th NTU: Not ranked SMU: Not ranked

QS Recruiters Survey (Asia Pacific) NUS:3rd NTU:10th SMU:40th

Economist Intelligence Unit NUS:89th NTU:81st SMU: Not ranked

U of Texas Dallas on Research Output NUS:47th NTU:75th SMU:89th

Eduniversal, France (Singapore) NUS:1st NTU:3rd SMU:4th

Beyond Grey Pinstripes NUS:88th NTU: Not ranked SMU: Not ranked
AACSB Accreditation NUS: Accredited NTU: Accredited SMU: Not accredited

EQUIS Accreditation NUS: In process NTU: Accredited SMU: Not accredited

ACRA for Accountancy (Singapore) NUS: Accredited NTU: Accredited SMU: Accredited

Times Higher Education Supplement NUS:30 (entire NUS) NTU:77 (entire NTU) SMU: Not ranked
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GSC1989
04-02-2009, 05:12 PM
Duration of courses

The duration of the honours programmes for the business courses for the abovementioned universities are:

NUS: 4 years. (Non-direct honours where you have to be invited to do your honours year based on results)

NTU: 3 years (Direct honours, meaning it is a 3 year direct honours course in which you graduate with honours if your grades make the cut at point of graduation.)

SMU: American honours system (Considered equivalent to direct honours, albeit with different naming: Cum Laude, Summa Cum Laude, Magna Cum Laude). 3 to 3.5 years depending on modules you are willing to overload.

Accreditation - Alex here has taken the trouble to send enquiries to all three universities :eek: , that's very helpful indeed, you could use it as a rough guide. However when factoring in accreditations, keep in mind that business courses are not specialized in general - what do you intend to work in the future? The accreditations may or may not be relevant to the job scope you have in mind.

Recognizability

Nanyang Business School, among the three university business faculties is by far considered to be the most established and popular business school in Singapore. They rank #1 in terms of business schools in SE Asia, and third in Asia overall.

Singapore Management University is not yet ranked as it is a new university, but many local employers have the opinion that SMU graduates are very out-spoken and eloquent people. This is due to their unique pedagogy (or else not so unique in time to come, but that's another story) and teaching.

In terms of international recognizability, should you decide to work overseas, people might favor the NUS BBA more. This is because to an overseas recruiter that does not know much about local education, the label 'National' in its name is often viewed as a sense of security when judging the quality of the degree.

Student profiles


SMU students are supposedly more vibrant/out-going due to the careful selection of students at the interview. (I wouldn't go as far as to claim it is a successful weeding process, however it is (was? :D) one of the factors that helped SMU students to stand out).

Facilities are rather new as it is a rather new university. One worthy point to mention is that despite it being a management university, the academia is still rigorous - do not go into this course thinking that you would have more leisure time to laze around/slack compared to choosing the other two.

On the NTU side, It's no hidden secret that NBS admissions are extremely competitive. After all, despite SMU's recent success in its business graduates, many prospective students still prefer to take the safer route by choosing a more established faculty.

The amount of chinese-speaking (ahem cheena?) students in NTU seem to outnumber their counterparts in the other two universities. Not that I am implying anything of course, just thought I would throw up the point of demographics.

Flexibility of modules and declaring of majors

NUS B.B.A is a general business administration degree associated with no majors.

NTU and SMU however, give you the option of declaring a major. In other words, the certificate will specify explicitly the major name on the certificate.
This, is retrospect, can be seen as a huge advantage to choose NTU and SMU Business over the NUS B.B.A. It would also reflect better on the resume.

One point that may be of note for Nanyang Business School though, that the selection of the major is subject to streaming as well.

Flexibility to take up Second Majors

SMU seems to be the most flexible university in terms of offering double majors. In fact, the entire course structure is designed in such a way that it almost seems as though it is trying to encourage every student to take up a second major.

Other minor considerations

- Distance. The roads leading to NTU is often jammed most of the time and if you are living in the east, it is rather inaccessible as it is so far away. The area NTU is in is also rather desolated compared to NUS.

- Hall life. Ask your seniors about this.

- Based on statistics, NTU students are paid higher than NUS students. (EDIT: Might not be true, see post below)


Personal Bias

I favor NBS actually. ^-^

Alex
04-02-2009, 05:57 PM
Flexibility of modules and declaring of majors

NUS B.B.A is a general business administration degree associated with no majors.

NTU and SMU however, give you the option of declaring a major. In other words, the certificate will specify explicitly the major name on the certificate.
This, is retrospect, can be seen as a huge advantage to choose NTU and SMU Business over the NUS B.B.A. It would also reflect better on the resume.

One point that may be of note for Nanyang Business School though, that the selection of the major is subject to streaming as well.


I think you are wrong here.

http://bschool.nus.edu.sg/NUSBBA/UndergraduateDegrees/BBAProgramme/tabid/691/Default.aspx
The following Business School academic departments provide links for preclusions to the above general rules:

Accounting
Business Policy
Decision Sciences
Finance
Management & Organisation
Marketing



Flexibility to take up Second Majors

SMU seems to be the most flexible university in terms of offering double majors. In fact, the entire course structure is designed in such a way that it almost seems as though it is trying to encourage every student to take up a second major.

I think you are wrong again here.
NUS and NTU has more DDP than SMU. In fact, NUS has foreign DDP which both NTU and SMU don't have...


Other minor considerations

- Based on statistics, NTU students are paid higher than NUS students.

I think this one, you again wrong... last year according to CNA report NUS highest paid among the 3...
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GSC1989
04-02-2009, 06:49 PM
I think you are wrong again here.
NUS and NTU has more DDP than SMU. In fact, NUS has foreign DDP which both NTU and SMU don't have...

Indeed. That's why I mentioned Second Majors, not double degrees :P. There is a difference between double majors and double degrees.


I think you are wrong here.

http://bschool.nus.edu.sg/NUSBBA/Und...1/Default.aspx
The following Business School academic departments provide links for preclusions to the above general rules:

Accounting
Business Policy
Decision Sciences
Finance
Management & Organisation
Marketing

It's quite stated that modules in the B.B.A can be taken to be specialized to certain tracks. I think the case in point for argument would be whether "specialization" is interpreted as a major. I don't think any of us is wrong unless it is implictly stated there.

http://bschool.nus.edu.sg/NUSBBA/Admissions/FAQ/tabid/670/Default.aspx


I think this one, you again wrong... last year according to CNA report NUS highest paid among the 3...

Last year eh? It could be possible I was wrong then. Thanks for clarifying anyway.

spencer
04-03-2009, 03:01 PM
Flexibility of modules and declaring of majors

NUS B.B.A is a general business administration degree associated with no majors.

NTU and SMU however, give you the option of declaring a major. In other words, the certificate will specify explicitly the major name on the certificate.
This, is retrospect, can be seen as a huge advantage to choose NTU and SMU Business over the NUS B.B.A. It would also reflect better on the resume.

One point that may be of note for Nanyang Business School though, that the selection of the major is subject to streaming as well.

Are you sure having a specialisation is good for a business degree?

All the top MBA programmes produce only MBAs, and not MBA (Finance) or MBA (Marketing). Only those second tier MBA schools need this MBA (specialisation) to help their graduates find jobs. The best MBA students from Columbia, Harvard and others become general managers/ general M&A.

By extension from MBA to BBA.

ernest
04-04-2009, 02:08 PM
Hello!

It seems to me that NTU & NUS have been marketing their ranking aggressively and I see it in the prospectus, open house etc.

However, please bear in mind that we're going for BBA not MBA or E-MBA. I've not found any ranking which guage the schools based on their BBA only. I suppose those that rank by "business school" take into account the overall.

The criteria for ranking's should also be taken into consideration, some criterias are simply based on surveys.

For me, I've chosen NUS as first choice followed by SMU. I took into consideration the various programmes, facilities and culture of the universities.

Eg: NUS has USP (if I can even get in), NUS overseas college, new building (coming late this year), NUS enterprise division and incubator programmes. (Well, u can see that I'm biased >.< )

Then for SMU, I think I'll like the class interaction culture and the small university compound because it makes travelling around the school easy.

Other factors that people consider would be the employment rate of the fresh graduates and the average starting salary.

There're some people who got 12k and 8k for their starting salary, but I guess they're exceptional talents who top dean list, win international competition and had excellent internship/final year project.

GES
04-05-2009, 04:57 PM
Global status (unless otherwise specified)

AACSB Accreditation NUS: Accredited NTU: Accredited SMU: Not accredited
EQUIS Accreditation NUS: In process NTU: Accredited SMU: Not accredited
ACRA for Accountancy (Singapore) NUS: Accredited NTU: Accredited SMU: Accredited


taken from HWZ: http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/showthread.php?t=1852354

Accreditation - AACSB - EQUIS or EMBA

Each has got their strength, does not neccessary means that those with triple crowns (all 3) are the Best. check out harvard, insead, cambridge - does any of these ivy league universities promote ALL 3 accreditions ? the fact is that they dont need to, the name of their university effectively sells themselve. Its those "mid" tier universities that are pushing for all 3 accrediation and shouting to the world that they are the best. scan the horizon and u see universities that are so called "triple crowns ' includes the following

Aston Business School, Aston University, Birmingham, UK
Ashridge Business School, Ashridge, UK
Audencia Nantes, Nantes, France
Brisbane Graduate School of Business, Queensland University of Technology, Brisbane, Grenoble School of Management Grenoble, France
Instituto de Empresa, Madrid, Spain
Lancaster University Management School, Lancaster, UK
Open University Business School, UK
Queen's School of Business, Canada
Rotterdam School of Management, Erasmus University Rotterdam, Rotterdam, The Netherlands
Toulouse Business School, Toulouse, France
Universiteit Maastricht, Maastricht, The Netherlands
University College Dublin, Michael Smurfit Graduate School of Business, Dublin, Ireland
University of Auckland Business School, Auckland, New Zealand
University of Waikato, Waikato Management School,Hamilton, New Zealand
Vlerick Leuven Gent Management School, Gent, Belgium

you can judge for yourselves are these comparable to the likes of Harvard and Wharton . a good university does not need all 3 accreditation, they will normally pursue one that is from their country of origin - ie. US universities - AACSB | UK universities - EMBA | european universities - EQUIS. Accreditations are time consuming and labourious excercise which take away quality time in research and teaching. Good universities have the clear presence of mind to focus their effort on students experience and reaseach.

spencer
04-06-2009, 01:27 AM
taken from HWZ: http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/showthread.php?t=1852354

Accreditation - AACSB - EQUIS or EMBA

Each has got their strength, does not neccessary means that those with triple crowns (all 3) are the Best. check out harvard, insead, cambridge - does any of these ivy league universities promote ALL 3 accreditions ? the fact is that they dont need to, the name of their university effectively sells themselve. Its those "mid" tier universities that are pushing for all 3 accrediation and shouting to the world that they are the best. scan the horizon and u see universities that are so called "triple crowns ' includes the following

Aston Business School, Aston University, Birmingham, UK
Ashridge Business School, Ashridge, UK
Audencia Nantes, Nantes, France
Brisbane Graduate School of Business, Queensland University of Technology, Brisbane, Grenoble School of Management Grenoble, France
Instituto de Empresa, Madrid, Spain
Lancaster University Management School, Lancaster, UK
Open University Business School, UK
Queen's School of Business, Canada
Rotterdam School of Management, Erasmus University Rotterdam, Rotterdam, The Netherlands
Toulouse Business School, Toulouse, France
Universiteit Maastricht, Maastricht, The Netherlands
University College Dublin, Michael Smurfit Graduate School of Business, Dublin, Ireland
University of Auckland Business School, Auckland, New Zealand
University of Waikato, Waikato Management School,Hamilton, New Zealand
Vlerick Leuven Gent Management School, Gent, Belgium

you can judge for yourselves are these comparable to the likes of Harvard and Wharton . a good university does not need all 3 accreditation, they will normally pursue one that is from their country of origin - ie. US universities - AACSB | UK universities - EMBA | european universities - EQUIS. Accreditations are time consuming and labourious excercise which take away quality time in research and teaching. Good universities have the clear presence of mind to focus their effort on students experience and reaseach.

Good post.

Uni College Dublin and Aston are not that bad. I know of a person from U C Dublin who worked at Lehman NY before transferring over to Merrill Lynch Capital Introductions. Another person from Aston business is working at Citi Prime Brokerage here in London, and she's really smart as well.

seeweiren
04-16-2009, 07:57 PM
Uni College Dublin and Aston are not that bad.

Surprisingly, never heard of Aston University... I seriously doubt Citi might recruit a graduate from Aston if the branch is situated in Singapore or Asia. Seriously, I think more recruiters in Asia will prefer a local graduate.On a contrary UCD degree is offered in Singapore under Kaplan Institute, knew some grads who are now working in Standard Chartered Bank.

O yup all three local Biz School are fantastic school, but to put in personal opinion, i think NTU has a stronger and better reputation in their graduate business school. NUS has a good and deep rooted undergraduate degree curriculum. SMU is new, fresh, upcoming and rising. Well they have quite strong faculty widely known around the world as well though new. To start off, they already have few faculty members who are widely known Sheen S Levine, Margaret Chan and Kenneth G Huang. All 3 Local schools are fantastic and good enough for you to choose from.

Alex
04-17-2009, 12:13 PM
I almost forgot. During dinner with a business associate of my father's company, he gave a piece of interesting information.

He is from Copenhagen, and hass been looking for a Business School in Asia for his kids. It seems that Copenhagen has a list of approved or recognised foreign business schools, and NUS Business School is the only Singapore Business School in the list of recognised foreign Business Schools.

Any seniors can help to verify this piece of information please?
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Alex
04-17-2009, 12:19 PM
Each has got their strength, does not neccessary means that those with triple crowns (all 3) are the Best. check out harvard, insead, cambridge - does any of these ivy league universities promote ALL 3 accreditions ? the fact is that they dont need to, the name of their university effectively sells themselve.

First of all, is NUS, NTU, SMU considered 1st tier Business Schools in the world?

NUS and NTU probably yes. SMU? Not a chance in the international scene.

Why do NUS and NTU or even SMU need such accreditations? Because they are NOT European or American schools! You see, what we have here is potentially what you can call a "protectionist" policy in a different light. Would Singapore recognise just any Business School from Malaysia? Does Malaysia even recognise NUS and NTU?

The accreditation is not necessary for American and European top tier schools, because it is in their own territory! Schools in other countries need these to ensure that their graduates can get employment in these protectionist regions. Especially when Europeans and Americans hardly understand education outside their very narrow definitions.

So the accreditations are VERY important for non-European and American schools.

NUS and NTU both are acrreditated is what we know. SMU, is just out of the league.
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SMUgger
04-17-2009, 04:14 PM
It seems that Copenhagen has a list of approved or recognised foreign business schools, and NUS Business School is the only Singapore Business School in the list of recognised foreign Business Schools.


NUS, NTU and SMU all has exchange partners with the major business schools in Copenhagen, so I don't see why any of them would not be recognised. The major Danish firms in Singapore, Maersk and Vestas, both employs many graduates from all 3 schools.

Alex
04-17-2009, 04:37 PM
NUS, NTU and SMU all has exchange partners with the major business schools in Copenhagen, so I don't see why any of them would not be recognised. The major Danish firms in Singapore, Maersk and Vestas, both employs many graduates from all 3 schools.

Have to check with the Copenhagen list, if anyone can find it. Exchange programmes are mostly for cultural immersion is what I understand it. Recognition, is another thing altogether.

But that coming from my dad's business associate, should have some truth. Just need seniors to find out if this is really true or he left out some lines in his search.
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uwishunu
04-17-2009, 05:45 PM
Hey guys,

I understand that the business courses in our local Universities are highly competitive. I have applied for all as my first choices. Yet to receive news from any, not even a single phone call for interview.

SMUgger
04-17-2009, 07:32 PM
Have to check with the Copenhagen list, if anyone can find it.

What is so special about the copenhagen list? Unless you are planning to migrate to Denmark I don't see how it is of any significance.

12oxas
04-19-2009, 06:50 PM
Hey guys!

I'm also quite in a dilemma right now. NTU's business school is better in terms of international ranking, with high number of employment rates and an average salary that is of one digit higher than that of alumni's from NUS business school. But NUS as a whole is much more recognized internationally.

Anyone has any idea an BBA from which school is more recognized internationally? (preferably by US) Thx!

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

@uwishunu: I don't want to disappoint you, but the round of interviews for SMU business may have already finished (I guess because all my friends that are shortlisted have been through it already 2 weeks ago). I'm not really sure about GPA because I went through the A levels system. But honestly I think that you have quite a good achievements record! (Mine sucks totally). Plus, NTU doesn't give interviews to everyone and I don't think there is an interview for NUS. So don't be too worried, we're still at the early stage of the "acceptance" period :)

seeweiren
04-19-2009, 08:53 PM
Hey guys!

I'm also quite in a dilemma right now. NTU's business school is better in terms of international ranking, with high number of employment rates and an average salary that is of one digit higher than that of alumni's from NUS business school. But NUS as a whole is much more recognized internationally.

Anyone has any idea an BBA from which school is more recognized internationally? (preferably by US) Thx!



If you are thinking of school that are recognised by US, it's better to choose SMU, as they are under the cum laude and US grading system. Industries in US prefer school that follows the US system rather to the Commonwealth system, gotten the source from my seniors working at HSBC US. However if it's NUS or NTU, i guess there's not much of difference in term of their international recognition, they are widely known in the world already.You will hear many students out there from the 3 Unis working abroad in big firms and companies.

Go look at the majors and specialisation they offer, as schools have different majors, like NTU and SMU offers Wealth Management, Investment Banking Track, but NUS only offer finance in general. Think NTU does not offer operation management as a major but NUS and SMU does. SMU and NUS offers Quantitative finance (if you aspire to be a fund manager).So go check out their website.

Look also at the timeframe and when you want to work, NUS is 4 years for honors program, while NTU is 3 years (which means more modules piled within the 3 years).

uwishunu
04-19-2009, 11:06 PM
Hi 12oxas: Thanks but I have already resigned to the fact that my achievements don't value as much due to my lackluster results. I guess the Singaporean education system is such.

In regards to your question, NUS is definitely much more renowned at an International level. However with NTU, it is straight honors within 3 years and you will be able to enter the workforce much earlier than your peers(which is an added advantage). I believe all 3 Universities have excellent business programs and it all depends on your personal preference. For me, SMU is extremely attractive with its teaching approach and the graduates I have met are definitely a class apart from other Universities.

If you are looking for an American University that offers an Internationally reclaimed business program, there are plenty. However, I recommend that you consider University of Michigan or Indiana, Bloomington. Both are public schools(affordable!) and their business schools are known to be the best in the world. America is definitely the choice to pursue further studies overseas. All the best.

Alex
04-20-2009, 06:28 PM
If you are thinking of school that are recognised by US, it's better to choose SMU, as they are under the cum laude and US grading system. Industries in US prefer school that follows the US system rather to the Commonwealth system, gotten the source from my seniors working at HSBC US.

I would disagree. To work in the USA or be recognised, you need the accrediations, which only NTU and NUS have. SMU has not been accredited, and can be said as largely not recognised as top tier in the US.

To say that by following a system is recognised, then would Singapore recognise a business degree from University of Mauritius just because it is also based on the Commonwealth system? No.

NTU and NUS are the ones to go for if you are looking for international recognition.
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12oxas
04-20-2009, 07:49 PM
Thx for all your replies! They were really insightful. :D

f you are thinking of school that are recognised by US, it's better to choose SMU, as they are under the cum laude and US grading system. Industries in US prefer school that follows the US system rather to the Commonwealth system, gotten the source from my seniors working at HSBC US.

@seeweiren: I was actually given the accountancy course. So i was wondering is that the same as the business course too? In terms of recognition.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
@uwishunu:Yeah i tried applying but my financial requirements dont meet the passing mark. I planning to take up a masters in US. Yup. Thx for ur reply! all the best to you too :)

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I would disagree. To work in the USA or be recognised, you need the accrediations, which only NTU and NUS have. SMU has not been accredited, and can be said as largely not recognised as top tier in the US.

@Alex: Somehow i feel the same with you too. I've checked a few popular buiz sch ranking sites. SMU doesn't seem to be even listed under the "Business schools in Singapore" column

seeweiren
04-22-2009, 07:56 AM
Thx for all your replies! They were really insightful. :D



@seeweiren: I was actually given the accountancy course. So i was wondering is that the same as the business course too? In terms of recognition.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------


@Alex: Somehow i feel the same with you too. I've checked a few popular buiz sch ranking sites. SMU doesn't seem to be even listed under the "Business schools in Singapore" column

The accountancy degree from SMU are quite comprable with the other 2 Local Uni. Well accountancy is a hot course, so generally, it will be harder to be admitted in an accountancy course as compared to a business degree given the no of place offered. Just FYI, SMU accountancy degree is accredited by ACCA or ICPAS (Can't remember is which 1) earlier than NUS, though they launch their programme later than NUS. If you really like those ranking and recognition, safe choice,go choose NTU then, they are highly sought after.

Don't just rely on school ranking solely or don't over rely on it. I can guarantee you that if you choose a school solely based on their ranking, you might not enjoy your full undergrad lifes. SMU does not have any business ranking or accreditation so to speak simply because they are just too new, and the word is new. To get even to meet the criteria to be placed in the MBA ranking they need to have the programme launch for at least 8 years. SMU need more years for before they can get accreditation.

Plus if you are really those people who are really into the corporate business world, i seriously think SMU is the most ideal place, with their super high great emphasis on business academics. I bet you have never heard of Helenski School of Economics or European Business School. These are universities in Europe that focus solely on Business, and they are one of the prestigious Business school in Europe.

Best advise, go look at the curriculum for all 3 and other universities curriculum, it is completely different if you think it's the same. For a start SMU don't have a final thesis to complete for the honors, it's 4 years full coursework.

twentythree
04-24-2009, 09:13 PM
Duration of courses

The duration of the honours programmes for the business courses for the abovementioned universities are:

NUS: 4 years. (Non-direct honours where you have to be invited to do your honours year based on results) - yup cause employers recognize the quality of a nus honors student and not everyone gets to be one, its very much merit based. as long as you get a 3.5/5 gpa you will qualify to complete your honors degree and YES it does affect your post grad chances if you so choose to do a quality mba/post grad program, quality meaning top 25 bschools, not just any. with a little research, 3 year programs in the states are associated with community colleges or akin to an associate degree..

NTU: 3 years (Direct honours, meaning it is a 3 year direct honours course in which you graduate with honours if your grades make the cut at point of graduation.)

SMU: American honours system (Considered equivalent to direct honours, albeit with different naming: Cum Laude, Summa Cum Laude, Magna Cum Laude). 3 to 3.5 years depending on modules you are willing to overload.

Accreditation - Alex here has taken the trouble to send enquiries to all three universities :eek: , that's very helpful indeed, you could use it as a rough guide. However when factoring in accreditations, keep in mind that business courses are not specialized in general - what do you intend to work in the future? The accreditations may or may not be relevant to the job scope you have in mind.

Recognizability

Nanyang Business School, among the three university business faculties is by far considered to be the most established and popular business school in Singapore. They rank #1 in terms of business schools in SE Asia, and third in Asia overall.

Singapore Management University is not yet ranked as it is a new university, but many local employers have the opinion that SMU graduates are very out-spoken and eloquent people. This is due to their unique pedagogy (or else not so unique in time to come, but that's another story) and teaching.

In terms of international recognizability, should you decide to work overseas, people might favor the NUS BBA more. This is because to an overseas recruiter that does not know much about local education, the label 'National' in its name is often viewed as a sense of security when judging the quality of the degree. beyond that the reputation and the quality of the alumni speaks volumes, did you know we have alumni who are gm lenovo ASEAN/Korea, yup boss of SEA and Korean markets, and of course the usual consulting and banking

Student profiles


SMU students are supposedly more vibrant/out-going due to the careful selection of students at the interview. (I wouldn't go as far as to claim it is a successful weeding process, however it is (was? :D) one of the factors that helped SMU students to stand out).

Facilities are rather new as it is a rather new university. One worthy point to mention is that despite it being a management university, the academia is still rigorous - do not go into this course thinking that you would have more leisure time to laze around/slack compared to choosing the other two.

On the NTU side, It's no hidden secret that NBS admissions are extremely competitive. After all, despite SMU's recent success in its business graduates, many prospective students still prefer to take the safer route by choosing a more established faculty.

The amount of chinese-speaking (ahem cheena?) students in NTU seem to outnumber their counterparts in the other two universities. Not that I am implying anything of course, just thought I would throw up the point of demographics.

Flexibility of modules and declaring of majors

NUS B.B.A is a general business administration degree associated with no majors. - more plus that con really, again with some research, the true blue bschools worldwide DONT OFFER SPECIALIZATIONS in banking or investment banking or pwm or human resource consulting, its a good solid business education allowing you to do whatever you so wish, cause you can, not because you need words and certain modules to back you up. the quality of the bba (nus or otherwise) is testament to that, hence the lack of suffixes.

NTU and SMU however, give you the option of declaring a major. In other words, the certificate will specify explicitly the major name on the certificate.
This, is retrospect, can be seen as a huge advantage to choose NTU and SMU Business over the NUS B.B.A. It would also reflect better on the resume.

One point that may be of note for Nanyang Business School though, that the selection of the major is subject to streaming as well.

Flexibility to take up Second Majors

SMU seems to be the most flexible university in terms of offering double majors. In fact, the entire course structure is designed in such a way that it almost seems as though it is trying to encourage every student to take up a second major.

Other minor considerations

- Distance. The roads leading to NTU is often jammed most of the time and if you are living in the east, it is rather inaccessible as it is so far away. The area NTU is in is also rather desolated compared to NUS.

- Hall life. Ask your seniors about this.

- Based on statistics, NTU students are paid higher than NUS students. (EDIT: Might not be true, see post below)


Personal Bias

I favor NBS actually. ^-^
well enough said mate ;)

twentythree
04-24-2009, 09:15 PM
I almost forgot. During dinner with a business associate of my father's company, he gave a piece of interesting information.

He is from Copenhagen, and hass been looking for a Business School in Asia for his kids. It seems that Copenhagen has a list of approved or recognised foreign business schools, and NUS Business School is the only Singapore Business School in the list of recognised foreign Business Schools.

Any seniors can help to verify this piece of information please?

yup ya right to some extend, though im certain that cbs does recognize the other two as well, nus bschool has a long standing exchange agreement with cbs and has performed well in their flagship international case competition www.casecompetition.com notice the schools invited are always amongst the best and to some extend cbs has chosen to associate themselves with nus

twentythree
04-24-2009, 09:21 PM
The accountancy degree from SMU are quite comprable with the other 2 Local Uni. Well accountancy is a hot course, so generally, it will be harder to be admitted in an accountancy course as compared to a business degree given the no of place offered. Just FYI, SMU accountancy degree is accredited by ACCA or ICPAS (Can't remember is which 1) earlier than NUS, though they launch their programme later than NUS. If you really like those ranking and recognition, safe choice,go choose NTU then, they are highly sought after.anyway, accountancy in singapore has its roots in nus, accounting was separated for the creation of nbs, so really simple, check out the cvs of the profs in ntu and smu, and of course the big 4 partners and managers, accreditation wise, if i remember only smu and nus is accredited by cpa australia and of course the usual singapore bodies, with a cpa australia accreditation, it allows you the flexibility to practice in commonwealth countries. so in sum its about the same across the three, but the crux is the intensity of the nus bba(accountancy) program, come down for the nus masterclass or welcome tea and im sure you guys will find out mroe from my friends in the BAC program

Don't just rely on school ranking solely or don't over rely on it. I can guarantee you that if you choose a school solely based on their ranking, you might not enjoy your full undergrad lifes. SMU does not have any business ranking or accreditation so to speak simply because they are just too new, and the word is new. To get even to meet the criteria to be placed in the MBA ranking they need to have the programme launch for at least 8 years. SMU need more years for before they can get accreditation. yeah please dont! rankings may be flashy and marketing ploys,what should guide your decision is comfort at the bschool, the people, the quality of education you be receiving

Plus if you are really those people who are really into the corporate business world, i seriously think SMU is the most ideal place, with their super high great emphasis on business academics. I bet you have never heard of Helenski School of Economics or European Business School. These are universities in Europe that focus solely on Business, and they are one of the prestigious Business school in Europe.well moot point to some extend, hse/sse and ebs have exchange programs with nus bschool, not the rest, academics wise, well best for applicants to peruse staff cvs that are easily available

Best advise, go look at the curriculum for all 3 and other universities curriculum, it is completely different if you think it's the same. For a start SMU don't have a final thesis to complete for the honors, it's 4 years full coursework. - YUP, the crux, the intensity and rigor differs across the 3 bschools, so do make your choice personal and not because its the best or the ranking's highest or it seems the most corporate, but because you want it, only then will you make it. just my two cents lads =)

twentythree
04-24-2009, 09:33 PM
For Nus, biz/accountancy course is 4 years while that in ntu is 3 years. - yup 3vs4, reason being for academic rigor and for reputation upkeep, the merit honors system is the preferred means of according degrees in bschool

Does anyone know whether that means nus grads may get more exemptions in professional accountancy exams than ntu grads cos they study more? Or do nus grads just study more biz stuff that's not very relevant to the exams.--eh for this, do check out which other accountancy bodies are affliliated with the 3 programs, believe locally as long as u graduate from any of the 3 there is no difference, however only nus bschool and smu accounting has the cpa australia accreditation - ie. you can practice in commonwealth countries easier

seeweiren
04-25-2009, 08:34 AM
Hi Twentytree, erm just fyi only, CBS, HSE and EBS are partner universities of SMU as well.

twentythree
04-25-2009, 09:05 AM
my bad, i think both smu and nus bschools have the higher grade of exchange partners, u guys got wharton so does nus which has stanford as well for the year long noc program. so guess thats the same. again my bad.

azsxdc
05-04-2009, 05:12 PM
- YUP, the crux, the intensity and rigor differs across the 3 bschools, so do make your choice personal and not because its the best or the ranking's highest or it seems the most corporate, but because you want it, only then will you make it. just my two cents lads =)

hi, so how would you rate the intensity and rigor of the 3 bschs? since we as prospective students would not know.

seeweiren
05-04-2009, 10:07 PM
hi, so how would you rate the intensity and rigor of the 3 bschs? since we as prospective students would not know.

Why not this? We provide you some information about some stuff that each different school practices, and you compare the intensity and rigor by yourselves. Because it's quite hard to compare when there are so many complex variable to compare the 3 school's curriculum. Plus, the grass is always greener on the other side. I always "whine" about how fortunate NTU and NUS biz school student are so lucky for not being as project intensive as SMU. While my fellow NTU and NUS peers think that their curriculum are always more demanding than mine.

Durations (For honors)
NTU-3 YRS
NUS SMU-4 YRS

Having 3 years means that they are squeezing all the content into 3 years so that you can graduate earlier, which means you have no choice but to finish more modules within a semester as compared to your peers' degree that are 4 years

Final Year Project/Thesis
NTU and NUS adopt a final year projects for their business school student. SMU does not require student to complete a final year projects as it's a 4 yr coursework, which means projects within a module.NUS and NTU first class honours require students to get at least an A- for their FYP, if not it will just be a 2nd upper honors.

Honors
NTU/NUS honors
2nd lower average B grade
2nd upper average B+ grade
1st class average A- grade with A- for FYP
SMU Honors
Cum Laude GPA>3.4 (B+ grade is 3.3)
Magma Cum Laude>3.6
Summa Cum Laude>3.8(A- grade is 3.7)

Tough to compare since SMU use Cum Laude System. Cum Laude is different from the honors adopted from commonwealth universities

Projects/Presentation
Touchy topic, but SMU will have more projects than NUS/NTU as SMU adopts a seminar session, so it means you will spent more times with your peers. NTU and NUS has tutorial and sometimes lecture where you are graded based on your projects. NTU and NUS are starting to adopt seminar system for some modules as well

Class Participation
As a Business student, you are required to be articulate and able to speak up, and interact with people. NUS and NTU has class participation for their tutorial but rarely for lectures, as lecture means there are 100 over students.
SMU has class participation which will constitutes to your grade for their seminars. This means you are require to come in class prepared to interact with your peers.

So if you ask me, I will say all 3 business school have quite a relative similar intensity so to speak.

azsxdc
05-05-2009, 09:56 AM
thanks for your quick reply. on a not so related note, i'd like to enquire abt the process of bidding of modules in the 3 diff unis. i heard that for ntu is fastest fingers first but for nus is not as simple? how about for smu?

Alex
05-11-2009, 05:29 PM
I would disagree. To work in the USA or be recognised, you need the accrediations, which only NTU and NUS have. SMU has not been accredited, and can be said as largely not recognised as top tier in the US.

To say that by following a system is recognised, then would Singapore recognise a business degree from University of Mauritius just because it is also based on the Commonwealth system? No.

NTU and NUS are the ones to go for if you are looking for international recognition.

And I have this to remind everyone. Remember the latest economic upheaval? Many people were sacked. If you have a less recognised degree, you are less mobile and have to stick to only 1 country (Singapore) for jobs.

So if the jobs move on, you are stuck on a boat with no engines, no sail and no oars. And your hull is leaking with committments.

International recognition is serious in long term survival. Not just $10,000 a month for 3 months (and contribute to start pay stats) then get sacked or not be confirmed, written off the stats and forgotten by the media henceforth.
________
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SMUgger
05-11-2009, 05:38 PM
So if the jobs move on, you are stuck on a boat with no engines, no sail and no oars. And your hull is leaking with committments.


Learn. To. Build. Your. Own. Boat.

:rolleyes:

Alex
05-12-2009, 05:29 PM
Learn. To. Build. Your. Own. Boat.

:rolleyes:

And what the employers say about boats:

http://forum.brightsparks.com.sg/showthread.php?t=3324

Real life bites.
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seeweiren
05-12-2009, 09:30 PM
And what the employers say about boats:

http://forum.brightsparks.com.sg/showthread.php?t=3324

Real life bites.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/18/business/economy/18grads.html?_r=1&hp

Internationally Recognized degree (or best degree in the world) = guaranteed good paying job in tough times.

I seriously doubt so.

Alex
05-13-2009, 12:36 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/18/business/economy/18grads.html?_r=1&hp

Internationally Recognized degree (or best degree in the world) = guaranteed good paying job in tough times.

I seriously doubt so.

And if recognised degree are not doing well, what does it say about those unrecognised degrees? :D
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seeweiren
05-13-2009, 10:36 PM
And if recognised degree are not doing well, what does it say about those unrecognised degrees? :D

To be defined a certificate as an unrecognised degree, it means that the degree is not endorsed or acknowledged by relevant organisation, and there is no memorandum or articles of association. They do not have a act where they are able to issue a degree or certificate.

Judging for this I do not see any difference of the 4 main biz school in Singapore (NUS,UNISIM,NTU,SMU), and also other private institution. It really brings down to the individual representing their own college.

profyip
05-15-2009, 11:31 PM
i am in a dilemma now and i hope to get some opinions but i dunno if this is the right thread to ask... i am being offered engineering and biz admin (acct) ddp from nus and acct and biz ddp from ntu but i dunno which one to accept. if you were me what would you choose and why?

GSC1989
05-15-2009, 11:55 PM
The decision would be hard to be honest; accounting + biz vs engg + biz admin put you into very different career tracks (assuming you are interested in the business component just as a complement to the main degree).

Although the amount of credits needed to get a Engineering + BizAdmin NUS DDP is a nightmare to deal with in the first place; it takes about 5 years and maybe even 6 years without proper planning. I'm sure that there are people completing the Engg+BizAdmin DDP in 4 to 4.5 years though, but it generally requires a lot of overloading of modules.

profyip
05-16-2009, 12:00 AM
so in your opinion ntu's ddp would be a better choice for me?

GSC1989
05-16-2009, 01:30 AM
so in your opinion ntu's ddp would be a better choice for me?

Wouldn't say so. What would you like to have for a career? Assuming you choose Engineering + BizAdmin, which engineering major do you intend to pursue?

profyip
05-16-2009, 10:09 AM
Wouldn't say so. What would you like to have for a career? Assuming you choose Engineering + BizAdmin, which engineering major do you intend to pursue?


i would probably choose chem engineering for the nus ddp... i am looking forward to a career in the financial sector, but why i chose to apply for the engg+acct ddp in nus is bcuz of the "back-up" engg degree that i can get which can widen my job opportunities in the future and is also useful if i want a career change. i am just wondering which acct degree or ddp combination is more recognised by employers...

skizzer
05-16-2009, 12:14 PM
lol i have exactly the same problem like u, if u wanna be an engineer, go nus, if u wanna work in finance sector go ntu, =)

i got common engineernig + biz(acc) and biz+ acc from those two schools too =), but i dun hav scholarship from ntu, so mostlikely going nus. =(

GSC1989
05-16-2009, 02:48 PM
i got common engineernig + biz(acc) and biz+ acc from those two schools too =), but i dun hav scholarship from ntu, so mostlikely going nus. =(

I'm facing the same dilemma as you as well ;) (albeit different with NTU's Business + Computing offer though). The thing that's holding me back on the NUS DDP is more of the syllabus integration and duration; it does provide more opportunities in terms of research opportunities though, which is a huge plus for an engineering track.

skizzer
05-16-2009, 05:15 PM
i guess the main thing is whether u wanna be an engineer or not =)

lol so many people with this dilemma 2 weeks left to decide =)

twentythree
05-16-2009, 05:19 PM
i dont think you are right in any sense to say that nus is the place for engineering while ntu is the place to go for finance. on what basis? risk management, derivative modules or centres of corporate governance? nor does ntu have a trading specialialization or hedge fund research centre like smu. or do they have a social enterprise and philanthropy centre? i dont think so. share more if you can ?

skizzer
05-16-2009, 05:27 PM
i dont think you are right in any sense to say that nus is the place for engineering while ntu is the place to go for finance. on what basis? risk management, derivative modules or centres of corporate governance? nor does ntu have a trading specialialization or hedge fund research centre like smu. or do they have a social enterprise and philanthropy centre? i dont think so. share more if you can ?

nono, i mean for people with dilemma like me and gsc, engineering + biz ni nus vs biz + sth else in ntu.

GSC1989
05-16-2009, 06:28 PM
i dont think you are right in any sense to say that nus is the place for engineering while ntu is the place to go for finance. on what basis?

He's saying to choose NUS Engineering + BizAdmin if one is really genuinely interested in an engineering career and Accountancy + Business DDP for the finance track. It is not a matter of comparing which university has a better engineering or accountancy or business programme :P; after all, you cannot pursue engineering interests with a Accountancy + Business DDP.

twentythree
05-16-2009, 06:44 PM
nope, what i was trying to get at to skizzer was that he's wrong to say that nus is better for engine and ntu better for a finance pov. ntu's engine is solid in itself, definitely plenty of overseas competition like nus engine.

doing a double degree in finance and business where its just showing you got two does not equate and translate into a person being more apt for a career in finance. the absolute number of modules taken in a business and accounting degree in either universities sees one taking barely more modules than a 4 years nus honors program. i am just curious to find out whats the true blue qualification to say the ntu finance or even the ntu double degree biz + acc program being the choice for a career in finance.

twentythree
05-16-2009, 06:48 PM
in fact engineering is a solid foundation for a career in finance, alot of the regular big 3 consulting, pe and banks love engineers. their analytical abilities are almost second to none, not to mention their math abilities. accounting as tough as it is, can still be picked up eventually, but the sort of training engineering provides is a whole different ball game. but more importantly do what you like, not where the money is. the money will come later if ya heart is in the right place.

skizzer
05-16-2009, 07:10 PM
true, its nt rite to say nus engineering is better than that of ntu just because of world ranking, anyway i have a different question here, anyone can provide me with an insight into whether a ddp in nus (sth like chem eng + biz(acc)) would be very stressful? coz i wanna enjoy uni life, dun wanna study everyday in library for 5 years... sob =(

xhellzx
05-19-2009, 11:38 PM
I think in terms of international reputation, NUS has a more reputable bachelors of business administration program than NTU. the word is bachelors. Because if you read carefully, most of the awards/placing that NTU outrank NUS is in the masters program.

In fact, NTU is the 2nd best uni in asia pacific (recently announced ranking).. but once again.. if you look carefully - it is the masters program. Sometimes I wonder why they advertise the masters program to ppl applying for bachelors (that they are the best business school). Because these programs are entirely and vastly different, they are not even using the same faculties most of the time.

Yeah, just a point that I have picked up and actually emailed NTU to clarify on this misrepresentation. Which they have admitted that it refers to their masters program when they said top business school. - notice the small astericks somewhere...

I guess its important to look at the course itself and not the hypes presented as some might not carry entire truths. SMU is too new to comment.. and international ranking takes into account the research done by Faculties and as a small school, i guess they don't stand much of a chance in this comparison. I am not entirely sure about the percentage of this weightage but this fact, i would hope, would make some to reconsider the importance of rankings and the use of it to judge a school.

Reputation is indeed important, but the intellectual stimulation of the course, career prospects (Smu econs students highest paid) are all not captured by rankings and magazine surveys.

Hope that helps =)

someone
05-29-2009, 04:13 PM
Hey guys, deadline's approaching fast and I'm still quite sitting on the fence which Uni to go?

Any help? Thanks :D

GSC1989
05-30-2009, 03:34 PM
Hey guys, deadline's approaching fast and I'm still quite sitting on the fence which Uni to go?

That will depend on what are the factors that affect your decision then.

Level of interaction between students and lecturers: SMU. Seminar-based learning and amount of class participation goes a long way. Smaller classes also means that professors are able to offer more individual help if required.

Depth and rigour: NUS. NUS has a considerably larger amount of business modules available for bidding compared to NTU/SMU. With NUS being a full fledged university, they also have the biggest range of minors. The ability to do a 4th honours year should be considered - you presumably learn more (in terms of academic content) in a NUS degree compared to NTU/SMU.

International Recognizability: NUS. The brand name that is associated with NUS appeals more to international recruiters that generally have no clue about any of the three universities here.

Regional Recognizability and Prestige: NTU. NBS is one of the top business schools in the region. Current rankings indicate NBS as being #1 in this region and 3rd overall in Asia. Might also like to add that NTU Business is considered more prestigous - as evidence, there are more people being rejected from NTU Business and accepted into SMU BBM/NUS BBA than the other way around. Proof of this is not hard to find.

Duration of course: NTU. A 3 year course (compared to 3.5-4 years for SMU BBM and 4 years for NUS honours) means that you can effectively complete an MBA in approximately the same amount of time that would have taken the NUS/SMU graduate to complete their bachelor degree. Even if you don't decide to do a MBA, this also means you effectively have a year's headstart in terms of work experience.

(Will not comment on the usefulness or the relevance of a MBA)

Vibrant student life: SMU. Although this is less seemingly true as time passes. SMU is situated in the middle of the business district though, feels as though you are already in the corporate life while traveling to SMU.

Second business majors: SMU. Requires the least amount of modules to clear for a second business major. Would also like to add that you can have the option of doing a second business major in NTU if you are declared eligible after the first year streaming process.

twentythree
05-31-2009, 12:37 AM
Regional Recognizability and Prestige: NTU. NBS is one of the top business schools in the region. Current rankings indicate NBS as being #1 in this region and 3rd overall in Asia. Might also like to add that NTU Business is considered more prestigous - as evidence, there are more people being rejected from NTU Business and accepted into SMU BBM/NUS BBA than the other way around. Proof of this is not hard to find.

-- this part is obviously contentious, took me some time to think if i should even spend time replying, but for the sake of "someone"- the original thread starter, i guess i should. "someone" if ya offered nus bschool, u should see the comparisons of the rankings, so enough said.

about people rejecting smu and nus bschools for ntu, well think again, every school can quote you examples. u need the stats and only moe has it. but look at it the other way, if you want to see the quality of intake, the indicative grade profile will give u an idea. the apparently brightest obviously dont reject nus bschool and the graduates despite even those who dont have straight honors like their ntu counterparts but have the same 3 year program in fact have more getting hired full time and just as much pay.

enough said.

GSC1989
05-31-2009, 04:22 AM
about people rejecting smu and nus bschools for ntu, well think again, every school can quote you examples.

Afraid you've misunderstood me. Just to clarify, I did not say that there are more people rejecting SMU and NUS Bschools to choose NTU. (I'll apologize if this caused any misunderstanding). To quote what I have just said,

as evidence, there are more people being rejected from NTU Business and accepted into SMU BBM/NUS BBA than the other way around

I was merely suggesting that there is greater demand for NTU Business courses. (since it is harder to get in). Wasn't saying that NUS Business was a "dumping ground" or anything (which I agree with you it obviously isn't true), in case you misinterpreted my point.

The criteria to be called up to NBS interview this year seems to involve having a grade profile that would have been deemed sufficient for the NUS Business faculty for direct admission (without interview). Perhaps this was different last year since the grade profile for NTU Business/NUS business 2008 was equivalent. If we conclude that the selection process is based on meritocracy of grades, then NBS must be harder to get in.

If NBS is harder to get in, this equates to being in more demand since NBS already allocates more places for business applicants compared to NUS.

I must admit, the inferences were made from anecdotal references and not actual statistics. (even if the amount of anecdotes is rather sizable). You are right in saying that unless we see the 2009 grade profile statistics, we would never know if this is true. In any case, I apologize in advance if the 2009 grade profile statistics prove me wrong :D (which is not likely in my honest opinion)

Just had to clarify in case you thought I was putting down NUS and SMU.

reebokvintage
05-31-2009, 09:06 AM
let me clarify the criteria to be accepted into NBS. Generally u have to have some As and Bs and a minimum of B for gp to be accepted into nbs. I Had ABB/A gp B pw A and was accepted directly into NBS , no interview needed. My friend with AAB/A gp D pw A was given econs instead of business(no biz interview granted to her at all). Another friend with AAA/B gp C was called up for biz interview , but failed it and was offered econs. Also the NBS biz course is highly exclusive in the sense that one has to have a strong gp Grade and stable H2 grades to get admitted. SMU biz accepted people with BBBD gp B pw A. Most of the person i know going to smu did not get NUS or NTU offer and their grades are lower relative to those heading for the first 2 Universities. most of my Friends heading to SMU have straight Bs and those that have better results are not considering smu at all. With that said, i am choosing NUS over NTU after much comtemplation. Then again, should i change my mind, i have 2 more tries just like every other NSF. Goodbye and Good day to y'all.

iceshiel
05-31-2009, 11:33 AM
if you do well. it doesnt matter where you got the degree.

melannsmiles
05-31-2009, 04:27 PM
' Most of the person i know going to smu did not get NUS or NTU offer and their grades are lower relative to those heading for the first 2 Universities. most of my Friends heading to SMU have straight Bs and those that have better results are not considering smu at all. '

true that most gg to smu did not get offer from nus or ntu, hence they accepted smu.

it was one of the considerations i took in as well when i made my decision. however, i chose smu in the end and gave up the offers from the other biz schs. i guess what attracted me was the fact they train us rigorously in presentation skills and being more confident and those are skills which should not be lacking when we join the corporate world next time. but of course you have to weigh yr options based on other factors as well.

nefariel
05-31-2009, 04:44 PM
if you do well. it doesnt matter where you got the degree.

i'm sorry, but this is fallacious logic, and a bunch of trash

iceshiel
05-31-2009, 06:56 PM
i'm sorry, but this is fallacious logic, and a bunch of trash

ouch. did i hit a sore spot? :(

GSC1989
05-31-2009, 09:56 PM
i'm sorry, but this is fallacious logic, and a bunch of trash

You might want to be less harsh on iceshiel. I think he means that if you do well in any of the three local universities, the degree should be equally recognized by local employers. (which is true) Of course, that does not mean that one should randomly pick the university without careful consideration beforehand (taking for granted that as long you get a degree, you are perfectly fine). Either way, I do not believe that iceshiel's intent of posting that message was as such.

nefariel
06-01-2009, 12:57 PM
hm i'm sorry if my message came across in the wrong tone.

all i was trying to say is that the statement "if you do well. it doesnt matter where you got the degree" is completely untrue.

iceshiel
06-01-2009, 09:00 PM
hm i'm sorry if my message came across in the wrong tone.

all i was trying to say is that the statement "if you do well. it doesnt matter where you got the degree" is completely untrue.

nah it's okay i wasnt angry. sorry i didnt elaborate enough. but GSC1989 summed up everything for me.

rockinik
06-01-2009, 09:26 PM
Hey guys, deadline's approaching fast and I'm still quite sitting on the fence which Uni to go?

Any help? Thanks :D

I think im a lil' late... but SMU!!!! did you pick SMU?

Alex
06-04-2009, 12:27 PM
however, i chose smu in the end and gave up the offers from the other biz schs. i guess what attracted me was the fact they train us rigorously in presentation skills and being more confident and those are skills which should not be lacking when we join the corporate world next time. but of course you have to weigh yr options based on other factors as well.

Do you mean to say that NTU and NUS Biz do not train their students in presentation skills rigourously and produce unconfident students?

Can you cite any first hand experience to make this comparison?

Note that what you are doing now is a comparison. Which means when you say one school has, the others will not have. If you are just wanting to say what one school has but all other has too, then the point is moot.
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seeweiren
06-05-2009, 09:52 PM
Do you mean to say that NTU and NUS Biz do not train their students in presentation skills rigourously and produce unconfident students?

Can you cite any first hand experience to make this comparison?

Note that what you are doing now is a comparison. Which means when you say one school has, the others will not have. If you are just wanting to say what one school has but all other has too, then the point is moot.

Let's just put it that way, NUS and NTU do have modules, which require them to present a certain projects and ideas in class or even lectures. They do equip their students with the necessary skills to present.

But the question is how intense or how frequent were the students given opportunities to present or a chance to speak out during lectures. The last thing in my peers (From NTU and NUS biz) was to ask questions during lectures, as asking and discussion means, delaying the lecture to end on time. I am not saying that they are not willing to speak, but more or so, they are not given much opportunities to voice up during class.

SMU does place emphasis or i should say more emphasis on a class participation and also class presentation. You are also assessed on modules which includes simple little things like Dining, Resume, or even Interview. Simple things like Community Involvement Project are also assessed as well, which means testing your EQ.

The only thing I did not see much in NUS or NTU is that they don't emphasise or train student to be EQ smart as compared to SMU. Once again, I am not saying their curriculum is bad or lousy.In fact,the curriculum in NUS or NTU are good, and comparable to some top school such as Wharton,Haas, LSE or even Sloan. However, what I find is that the soft skill and communication emphasis is not that strong in NBS or NUS business school.Some thing SMU has a strength or place emphasis in.

O yes, just some advise for those freshman who are studying in business faculty out there, whether if you are in SMU/NTU or NUS. If you think that your straight As or colourful results in A level or A in econs means you will do well in school. Think twice and better study hard for it, as Business modules are not as easy as what you think.

I have just embarked on an internship in a Financial Service Company and I will say to do well in the finance industry, you not only need the brilliant IQ, which you most probably have. You need also the EQ which starts very much in School. :)

skizzer
06-05-2009, 11:40 PM
Let's just put it that way, NUS and NTU do have modules, which require them to present a certain projects and ideas in class or even lectures. They do equip their students with the necessary skills to present.

But the question is how intense or how frequent were the students given opportunities to present or a chance to speak out during lectures. The last thing in my peers (From NTU and NUS biz) was to ask questions during lectures, as asking and discussion means, delaying the lecture to end on time. I am not saying that they are not willing to speak, but more or so, they are not given much opportunities to voice up during class.

SMU does place emphasis or i should say more emphasis on a class participation and also class presentation. You are also assessed on modules which includes simple little things like Dining, Resume, or even Interview. Simple things like Community Involvement Project are also assessed as well, which means testing your EQ.

The only thing I did not see much in NUS or NTU is that they don't emphasise or train student to be EQ smart as compared to SMU. Once again, I am not saying their curriculum is bad or lousy.In fact,the curriculum in NUS or NTU are good, and comparable to some top school such as Wharton,Haas, LSE or even Sloan. However, what I find is that the soft skill and communication emphasis is not that strong in NBS or NUS business school.Some thing SMU has a strength or place emphasis in.

O yes, just some advise for those freshman who are studying in business faculty out there, whether if you are in SMU/NTU or NUS. If you think that your straight As or colourful results in A level or A in econs means you will do well in school. Think twice and better study hard for it, as Business modules are not as easy as what you think.

I have just embarked on an internship in a Financial Service Company and I will say to do well in the finance industry, you not only need the brilliant IQ, which you most probably have. You need also the EQ which starts very much in School. :)

agree agree hey any ntu biz/acc seniors mind sharing experiences abt modules and coursework in school?

melannsmiles
06-06-2009, 10:05 PM
Do you mean to say that NTU and NUS Biz do not train their students in presentation skills rigourously and produce unconfident students?

Can you cite any first hand experience to make this comparison?

Note that what you are doing now is a comparison. Which means when you say one school has, the others will not have. If you are just wanting to say what one school has but all other has too, then the point is moot.

Thanks seeweiren for explaining it nicely!

To make or even imply such a statement that 'NTU and NUS biz do not train students presentation skills rigourously and produce unconfident students' is an obvious over-generalization ( and we have been taught in gp to never make such definite statements)
obviously each sch would produce their fair share of confident students, well-honed in presentation skills and being outspoken. but i what i was implying in smu's case is that because they include such a huge % of presentation and class participation points in yr gpa, it makes it imperative for most students to speak up in class and/or give a speech confidently enough.

'Note that what you are doing now is a comparison. Which means when you say one school has, the others will not have.If you are just wanting to say what one school has but all other has too, then the point is moot.' and my reply to this that yes i was doing a comparison, but why is it that if one sch has, the others will not have? i think this statement is invalid. simply, because there is also the possiblity of all schools having it, but one school having more than the other schools? and i value the fact that smu makes it more or less compulsory to speak out, while for the other 2 schools it is not necessary for one to speak out so often, since less weightage is given to class participation, in order to secure a good score.

dt88
06-07-2009, 08:20 PM
hi ppl, any SMU business senior here would care to share some insight of the course.. saw some maths-related modules in the curriculum and is it very difficult? cause i didnt take A maths in sec sch and even though i did some engineering maths in poly i think the standard of my maths is still very weak so do SMU have any bridging programme to allow me to cope better with those modules? Does one have to possess a good command of english and also be mathematically inclined to at least obtain an average grade for all the modules? thanks in advance for any reply given. =)

Alex
06-09-2009, 09:08 AM
Let's just put it that way, NUS and NTU do have modules, which require them to present a certain projects and ideas in class or even lectures. They do equip their students with the necessary skills to present.

But the question is how intense or how frequent were the students given opportunities to present or a chance to speak out during lectures. The last thing in my peers (From NTU and NUS biz) was to ask questions during lectures, as asking and discussion means, delaying the lecture to end on time. I am not saying that they are not willing to speak, but more or so, they are not given much opportunities to voice up during class.

SMU does place emphasis or i should say more emphasis on a class participation and also class presentation. You are also assessed on modules which includes simple little things like Dining, Resume, or even Interview. Simple things like Community Involvement Project are also assessed as well, which means testing your EQ.

The only thing I did not see much in NUS or NTU is that they don't emphasise or train student to be EQ smart as compared to SMU. Once again, I am not saying their curriculum is bad or lousy.In fact,the curriculum in NUS or NTU are good, and comparable to some top school such as Wharton,Haas, LSE or even Sloan. However, what I find is that the soft skill and communication emphasis is not that strong in NBS or NUS business school.Some thing SMU has a strength or place emphasis in.

O yes, just some advise for those freshman who are studying in business faculty out there, whether if you are in SMU/NTU or NUS. If you think that your straight As or colourful results in A level or A in econs means you will do well in school. Think twice and better study hard for it, as Business modules are not as easy as what you think.

I have just embarked on an internship in a Financial Service Company and I will say to do well in the finance industry, you not only need the brilliant IQ, which you most probably have. You need also the EQ which starts very much in School. :)


And why are only NUS and NTU recognised and awarded points by international employers as indicated in international surveys?

This thing about SMU producing confident, students or "more" confident students is not even a "fact", for the simple reason that nobody has a survey with a good sample size to verify that. It just a marketing ploy that many have allowed themselves to believe without seeking statistical verification.

Also, as an employer, would you prefer someone who can talk a lot, but has less substance than someone who talks a little less, but has all it takes to bring your business to the next level?

If you guys want to paint SMU as the one with a lot of talk, you will only be saying that with the same amount of training hours, NTU and NUS are training their students in the required substance.

I totally disagree that SMU has anything over the other 2. In fact, I choose to believe international statistical surveys recognising NTU and NUS as internationally credible institutions. Not that it says anything bad about SMU, but it just says a lot of NTU and NUS, but NOTHING about all the simply made up stuff with no statistical credibility of SMU.
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GSC1989
06-09-2009, 02:08 PM
And why are only NUS and NTU recognised and awarded points by international employers as indicated in international surveys?

SMU is a rather new university compared to the other two, don't think there are enough alumni to hold an actual survey yet.

This thing about SMU producing confident, students or "more" confident students is not even a "fact", for the simple reason that nobody has a survey with a good sample size to verify that. It just a marketing ploy that many have allowed themselves to believe without seeking statistical verification.

Local and even international employers are extremely stubborn and rigid in welcoming any change (in this case, graduates from new universities). If SMU graduates did not have anything to shine out against NUS/NTU students, they would never be able to break the stigma of employers in the first place. After all, the HR departments of big companies are not obliged to hire them.

Take it this way - if NUS/NTU students were as good as SMU students in speaking out, and had better academic foundations to boot, why even hire SMU graduates?

It just a marketing ploy that many have allowed themselves to believe without seeking statistical verification

Yet, most of the people responsible for the marketing ploys come from SMU alumni and current undergraduates. Despite the usual skepticism about new universities from singaporean youths, SMU were able to convince prospective students that they knew what they were talking about. You also cannot deny that their teaching pedagogy is indeed different. If this was not true, SMU degrees would have ended up being regarded on similar recognizability as private universities.

On a personal note, I attended the SMU open house recently. While I did not end up picking SMU for its business course, I was really impressed with how the Open House was conducted. There were plenty of SMU students there that were extremely outspoken and fervently promoting their courses like actual salespeople. It actually took some effort to discern the actual content of some of their speeches :D

I also believe that seeweiren's points are valid; employers here DO have positive impressions of SMU students so far. However, it is too early to tell if SMU can keep this up though.

Also, http://conference.nie.edu.sg/2007/paper/papers/CUL580.pdf (not actual statistical evidence though)


Also, as an employer, would you prefer someone who can talk a lot, but has less substance than someone who talks a little less, but has all it takes to bring your business to the next level?

You cannot bring any business to the next level without being sales-oriented. In fact, many engineers in Singapore contribute GREATLY to the success of their companies, and end up with their efforts going unnoticed. Only people who speak up get to take credit for their work. Higher EQ makes you more comfortable in dealing with work politics ;).

Put it this way - there is already an abundance of people who know their stuff (and NUS and NTU are extremely proficient in producing such graduates). The demand for people who actually know how to 'talk the walk' however, is a lot higher. The decline in average pay from engineering professions already suggests so. (why are business/econs graduates receiving a higher pay compared to the professionals? Furthermore, for engineers/accountants to rise up to management, they MUST acquire soft skills which business students have as well.)

EDIT: P.S: Above statement might change over the years (or maybe starting even now) with the finance crisis, but this generally holds true over the last decade.

seeweiren
06-09-2009, 03:10 PM
And why are only NUS and NTU recognised and awarded points by international employers as indicated in international surveys?

In fact, I choose to believe international statistical surveys recognising NTU and NUS as internationally credible institutions. Not that it says anything bad about SMU, but it just says a lot of NTU and NUS, but NOTHING about all the simply made up stuff with no statistical credibility of SMU.

Well I guess a credible source will not even want to rank SMU ahead of HEC Montreal, City U HK, Uni of Melbourne, if they are not internationally credible.

http://som.utdallas.edu/top100Ranking/searchRanking.php?t=w

Statistical credibility of any college can be find worldwide, sadly I guess you might have missed some of the credible sources that put SMU in a nice picture. Isn't quite a significant accomplish for a school within only 10 years of history to placed quite on par with many international business school. This is just one sources, and there are many other credible sources out there that justify SMU's reputation, and that's if you agree or do not agree to it.

O yes,Statistical credibility requires proof and evidence, the proofs and evidence comes from the results and performance from the school's performance. So where does SMU results and performance comes from? It's the stuff which you have been seeing and hearing from the mass industry of Singapore.

O have I not mentioned? The curriculam that is constantly changing within NUS Business School and NBS seems to be spear-headed by SMU. Seminars were put in place in NUS and NTU to advocate people to speak out more after SMU introduce it. Industry relevance track and compitences were put in place and started off by SMU which introduce the Wealth Management, International Trading and Investment Banking Track. And now NTU has those tracks as well.

The 3 schools are unique and strong in their respective fields. No one can deny or disagree that NTU accountancy has been the best and deep-rooted school with great tie-up with University of Illinois. No one can deny or disagree that NUS EMBA programme is one of the best across the world and in Asia. Similarly, no one can deny that SMU Business program is unique and prepare graduates who dare to be different, outspoken,and industry competent. :)

Alex
06-10-2009, 09:21 AM
Well I guess a credible source will not even want to rank SMU ahead of HEC Montreal, City U HK, Uni of Melbourne, if they are not internationally credible.

http://som.utdallas.edu/top100Ranking/searchRanking.php?t=w


I says NUS and NTU are ranked ABOVE SMU. :)
I take this as an admission that SMU is not as good as advertised.

O yes,Statistical credibility requires proof and evidence, the proofs and evidence comes from the results and performance from the school's performance. So where does SMU results and performance comes from? It's the stuff which you have been seeing and hearing from the mass industry of Singapore.
This is exactly what I was pointing out as fluff! Only pure marketing and "feeling". I am not against SMU for a fact. I am against all the fluffy "feelings" and plain marketing which affects some of our friends from understading the real stuff that they are seeking.

Thanks for pointing it out!
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seeweiren
06-10-2009, 11:28 AM
I says NUS and NTU are ranked ABOVE SMU. :)
I take this as an admission that SMU is not as good as advertised.


This is exactly what I was pointing out as fluff! Only pure marketing and "feeling". I am not against SMU for a fact. I am against all the fluffy "feelings" and plain marketing which affects some of our friends from understading the real stuff that they are seeking.

Thanks for pointing it out!

I beg to differ from the point of view that what SMU marketing and feeling as fluff, as I guess in no way is one able to justify that the stuff we potray and do are fluff, unless you experience it. In SMU, we call it the SMU experience. Only when you undergo it, experience it, you will see the difference. It went as the same back in 2002 or 2004 (few years back) where there was such a big debate when SMU market themselves as different and unique. People either take it or they don't. Undeniable that the whole comparison started so much when SMU make such a remarkable distinction of being different from the 2 local universities.

In no doubt, NUS and NTU are highly ranked simply because of the strong and deep rooted curriculum, faculty and alumni over more than 50 years. However, for a university to be ranked as one of the top few universities across the world within a short timeframe of 10 years. I guess that speaks a lot about the strength and the background the school has.

"I am against all the fluffy "feelings" and plain marketing which affects some of our friends from understading the real stuff that they are seeking."

I am not sure what you mean by plain marketing, as many of our open house or talk we held in school comprise of testimonials of what student themselves undergo. I guess that speaks alot about why SMU students are much happier in their school as compared to NTU or NUS in survey back in 2006.

twentythree
06-10-2009, 02:48 PM
ahh anyway admissions is over, acceptance too. the schools tally and result scorecards will be out and we will then have a better idea of how the publicity, how all the lobbying, how the openhouse/welcome team/masterclass has fared.

happiness wise, guess lets try faculty based surveys and we have a better idea then, i am pretty cock sure that nus bschool wont be at the bottom ;) and maybe from then till nows results might have changed or not, so it is only by asking ST to conduct another survey, can we have a better idea

just a couple of things. Way before smu was born, both ntu and nus bschools had seminar style learning, its just not for all, its mostly for your level 2000 or 200 in smu speak classes and above. So sorry for bursting the bubble, its just how we singaporeans take the best practices of yale, harvard and applying it here. rationale for lectures for foundation mods and seminar for advance mods is simple. the foundation mods are to give you the basics, the fundamentals and grounding, class room enquiry and participation is already in the tutorials, 3 hours of classes for each module will give your the foundation. thats the basis. the room and need for discussions comes up as we advance. well thats what we copied,might not be the best now, who knows !

another really weird thing i hear, "smu's marketing department must be damm good, look at the ads!" again misconception, its the ad agency, so really there is a lot of information out there, everyones got to be mindful of how we process them. NUS's ads mostly suck, they are getting better but they decided not to advertise this year cause of choosing to allocate the money to scholarships and bursaries for the less well off students. makes sense i guess, better than shitty ads!

and as always rankings are not everything, choose the right place that makes you the happiest, gives you the best opportunities to develop yourself, literally bring the best out of yourselves. the top mba or emba school is moot to everyone at the undergraduate level. Its like the man utd youth team bragging they "won" the premiership when it doesn even affect them. so really rankings with a pinch of salt. it helps with some recognition but its not everything.

meanwhile, hang on for the good news that will be coming out from nus bschool soon ;)

spencer
06-11-2009, 05:19 AM
Well I guess a credible source will not even want to rank SMU ahead of HEC Montreal, City U HK, Uni of Melbourne, if they are not internationally credible.

http://som.utdallas.edu/top100Ranking/searchRanking.php?t=w


This ranking is stupid. 1. the name of the business school is much more important than its research. 2. a big part of business schools is its ability to land graduates into good jobs; nothing matters more 3. the schools are ranked by the no. of publications, not citation.

spencer
06-11-2009, 05:26 AM
Put it this way - there is already an abundance of people who know their stuff (and NUS and NTU are extremely proficient in producing such graduates). The demand for people who actually know how to 'talk the walk' however, is a lot higher. The decline in average pay from engineering professions already suggests so. (why are business/econs graduates receiving a higher pay compared to the professionals? Furthermore, for engineers/accountants to rise up to management, they MUST acquire soft skills which business students have as well.)


Because engineers face the corrosive effects of globalisation to a much larger extent than the people in the financial industry.

The point is so flawed. Substituting your sentence gives:

for business students to rise up to management, they MUST acquire hard skills which engineers/accountants have as well.

Which may be preferable to you but probably impossible for a vast majority of the people. I cannot imagine how you can teach fourier transforms to business students.

Alex
06-11-2009, 10:33 AM
I am not sure what you mean by plain marketing, as many of our open house or talk we held in school comprise of testimonials of what student themselves undergo. I guess that speaks alot about why SMU students are much happier in their school as compared to NTU or NUS in survey back in 2006.

You mean SMU Open House/Marketing people will not screen through the senior first before allowing them to "feature" in any event? Of course they will choose those who are happy there to begin with!

How about showing the FULL picture and including those who apply to transfer from SMU to NTU and NUS or simply have to stay in SMU as they cannot make the NTU/NUS cut and continue to bitch about SMU?

See the point about simply made up fluff I am making?
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Alex
06-11-2009, 11:25 AM
I guess that speaks alot about why SMU students are much happier in their school as compared to NTU or NUS in survey back in 2006.

http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/2446/65919291.jpg
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sonrocker
06-11-2009, 11:49 AM
wow, when was this published? Alex, wondering how i could get my hands on the article. kinda curious to read the whole thing.

agnes
06-11-2009, 12:06 PM
wow, when was this published? Alex, wondering how i could get my hands on the article. kinda curious to read the whole thing.

you can read the article here:
http://bschool.nus.edu.sg/Portals/0/images/MBA/docs/Hip-ST-Oct26-p3.pdf

sonrocker
06-11-2009, 12:16 PM
Thank you agnes. The article seems to present quite a balanced view.

agnes
06-11-2009, 12:21 PM
Oh, I just read the article and realised that it is dated back to 2004... In the past 5 years, I do think there has been distinct improvement from SMU which has been recognised by our employers.

So, the contents of the article should be re-evaluated, yes? It is no longer indicative of SMU's aptitude and popularity as a school.

This ‘hip’ Survey, by the way, is totally different from that previously mentioned seeweiren before about SMU students being happier and so we should not be putting the two into comparison.

Still, I feel that all Universities have their own positives and their own cultures. So it is really up to the individual to decide which is more suitable for him.

cleanerdung
06-11-2009, 01:04 PM
How about showing the FULL picture and including those who apply to transfer from SMU to NTU and NUS or simply have to stay in SMU as they cannot make the NTU/NUS cut and continue to bitch about SMU?


http://uniquefrequency.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/sa-research-315x420.jpg

Yes, I'll like to hear from the remaining 43% too :)

(Image taken from http://uniquefrequency.com/2009/04/14/research-is-great-but-you-still-gotta-ask-the-right-question/)

makeadifference
06-11-2009, 01:26 PM
to sum it up, a university degree can only get you so far. In the working world, as long as you are capable enough to outperform, management does not care if you graduated from nus/smu/ntu.


so i agree with twentythree, and choose a place that you find most suitable for you.

:)

Alex
06-11-2009, 01:52 PM
http://www.todayonline.com/BreakingNews/EDC090610-0000065/More-top-students-opt-for-PSC-awards

MORE top students here are opting for Public Service Commission (PSC) university scholarships, according to a recent survey by scholarship portal BrightSparks.

The PSC manages the slew of study awards for the public sector, which is Singapore???s biggest employer.

The results of the BrightSparks Scholarship Rankings & Career Survey 2009 also showed that the percentage of top students keen on working for the public service grew from 23.3 per cent to 33.8 per cent this year.

Said Mr Lim Der Shing, director of JobsFactory which manages the portal: ???The Government has stepped up on hiring despite the economic downturn, which could be a key reason for more top students considering a career in Public Service than before. The private sector may also be perceived to offer less job security currently.???

The PSC emerged as the scholarship provider of choice with 56 per cent of the top students, while the National University of Singapore came in second.

Coming in third was the FIREfly group of government organisations - the human resource collaboration among statutory boards under the Ministry of Trade and Industry, such as the Economic Development Board and Singapore Tourism Board.

But when it comes to which industry they???d rather have a career in, banking and financial services is top of the list - the current turmoil in the sector notwithstanding. A public service job comes in a close second, while airline/travel ranks third.

A top scorer at Raffles Junior College last year, Mr Wang Yong Jin applied for a PSC scholarship. He dismissed the suggestion that he is joining the public service for the ???iron rice bowl???.

???My parents run a business so if I wanted security, I???d join them for work,??? said the 19-year-old. ???The PSC is an established scholarship board which has a track record of grooming applicants.???

Armed with nine distinctions, he plans to read economics at Harvard University or Stanford University after his National Service stint.

The survey also found that students are being more prudent in these lean times: 37 per cent of respondents said they would apply only to local universities, up from 32.5 per cent last year.

The number opting to study at foreign institutions fell from 8.3 per cent to 4.8 per cent. This could be because ???local universities are able to offer students a cheaper, but not necessarily less attractive option, in the current economic recession???, said Mr Lim.

The BrightSparks Scholarship Portal has, since October 2004, served as a one-stop site for scholarship research and applications.

All 84 scholarship providers in Singapore, both government and non-government, use its services.

A total of 3,252 students participated in the survey, which for the first time included International Baccalaureate Diploma graduates.
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seeweiren
06-12-2009, 11:53 AM
http://www.smu.edu.sg/news_room/smu_in_the_news/2007/sources/ST_20070716_1.pdf

That's the article I am refering, about SMU students being happier than their peers. :)

spencer
06-15-2009, 03:16 AM
http://www.smu.edu.sg/news_room/smu_in_the_news/2007/sources/ST_20070716_1.pdf

That's the article I am refering, about SMU students being happier than their peers. :)
Do SMU students actually think that they are studying in a Wharton style business school? Is this their source of "false happiness"?

cleanerdung
06-15-2009, 09:04 AM
Do SMU students actually think that they are studying in a Wharton style business school? Is this their source of "false happiness"?

from another forum:


SMU's ties with Wharton does give it some lift, in many ways, like research, networking, and maybe even curriculum. And in another sense, it can be comforting to some that the system SMU uses is from the best (or one of) business school in the world. That is some assurance that they will have a quality education, and not just of a random startup university.


http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/showpost.php?p=36256958&postcount=6

makeadifference
06-15-2009, 10:08 AM
Do SMU students actually think that they are studying in a Wharton style business school? Is this their source of "false happiness"?

Lol, i dont think smu students would feel any much happier/sadder about whether their sch is modelled after Wharton business school. I mean like seriously, no matter what sch one is in, what makes the persons' stay most enjoyable is the culture (ie.vibrant env, sch activities etc), the friends they make and many other things. it would be funny should anyone be thinking, ''oh my school smu is almost like Wharton business school, and this makes me feel happier/greater/better!'' maybe taking after a Wharton style business school would convince some to choose smu, but i dont think it would impact current smu students very much, hence your claim of their source of "false happiness'' doesnt hold.

by the way, i am not a smu student!

koo86
06-25-2009, 12:15 AM
SMU business school isn't even AACSB accredited

cleanerdung
06-27-2009, 02:34 PM
Is this for real?

http://theblueandgold.wordpress.com/2009/01/22/increasing-stress-in-smu-students/

Increasing Stress in SMU Students
We interview University Counsellor Timothy Hsi to find out why

Q: Is it true that student stress levels in SMU are on the rise?

A: There have been various reports that students are complaining that school life has been very tough for them. Local exchange students from NUS and NTU have also expressed that SMU student life is much tougher than they are used to.

There are more cases of students with stress issues, insomnia and depression. This might lead to secondary issues like break down in relationships, mental issues, or in some cases suicidal tendencies.

In fact in this term alone, there have been 62% more students going for counseling assistance than the whole of the previous academic year

koo86
06-28-2009, 10:38 AM
Is this for real?

http://theblueandgold.wordpress.com/2009/01/22/increasing-stress-in-smu-students/

Increasing Stress in SMU Students
We interview University Counsellor Timothy Hsi to find out why

Q: Is it true that student stress levels in SMU are on the rise?

A: There have been various reports that students are complaining that school life has been very tough for them. Local exchange students from NUS and NTU have also expressed that SMU student life is much tougher than they are used to.

There are more cases of students with stress issues, insomnia and depression. This might lead to secondary issues like break down in relationships, mental issues, or in some cases suicidal tendencies.

In fact in this term alone, there have been 62% more students going for counseling assistance than the whole of the previous academic year



Yeap, been there for a year and I know how its like. The workload is ridiculous, scratch that, its Ludicrous. I took 4 modules during the first semester of school and I had 6 written assignments ( 3 of which are academic papers : thesis etc) , 5 projects , 6 presentations (preparation and presentation) and lastly 1 exam paper. Just imagine all of this in just 12 academic weeks. My weekends were spent in school on project meetings.

jimjoker1
03-12-2010, 10:32 AM
Forthe Bachelor of Business degree;
NTU - 3 yrs direct honours
NUS - 3 years to complete; with option to go another year if u want honours
SMU - 4 years direct honours(honours difficult to get)

In view of the length of study for SMU i.e 4 years, and also the fact that school fees are about $3000 higher if you study in SMU, the big question is: IS IT REALLY WORTHWHILE TO STUDY IN SMU FOR ONLY A BUSINESS DEGREE? If you say 4 yrs with a professional degree like accounting, engineering, law, etc, definitely worth its salt, but for Business(a general degree, easily obtainable anywhere), just wonder if it's really worth it!

yl09
04-05-2010, 09:21 AM
Forthe Bachelor of Business degree;
NTU - 3 yrs direct honours
NUS - 3 years to complete; with option to go another year if u want honours
SMU - 4 years direct honours(honours difficult to get)

In view of the length of study for SMU i.e 4 years, and also the fact that school fees are about $3000 higher if you study in SMU, the big question is: IS IT REALLY WORTHWHILE TO STUDY IN SMU FOR ONLY A BUSINESS DEGREE? If you say 4 yrs with a professional degree like accounting, engineering, law, etc, definitely worth its salt, but for Business(a general degree, easily obtainable anywhere), just wonder if it's really worth it!

I wonder how accurate your information about SMU is since SMU does not even use the honours system.

forrest
04-05-2010, 09:58 PM
Hello everyone,

I find this statistics from MOE a tad disturbing (as I'm matriculating this year and I thought of choosing NTU over SMU).

On average, with honours, SMU's business graduates (http://www.moe.gov.sg/education/post-secondary/files/ges-smu.pdf)earn $3,336, NUS's business graduates (http://www.moe.gov.sg/education/post-secondary/files/ges-nus.pdf) earn $3,389 and NTU's business graduates (http://www.moe.gov.sg/education/post-secondary/files/ges-ntu.pdf)earn $2,754.

I thought of choosing NTU over SMU due to the course duration (a discount of 1 year), but these data provided by MOE (which I presume to be unbiased and reliable) make me wonder if I've indeed made the right choice.

If you were me, what would you do?

Any advise or opinion from anyone?

Thanks in advance.

Haecceity
04-05-2010, 10:18 PM
Simply put: how much higher a salary do you think one extra year of working experience affords you? (The answer to that could also depend on where you're aiming to work after graduation.)

Oh, and your link for NUS business grads links for NTU. :p

seeweiren
04-07-2010, 12:53 AM
I wonder how accurate your information about SMU is since SMU does not even use the honours system.

You should go read up before you made such comment....

SMU adopts the US Latin Cum Laude Honors System, which is different from the British Honors system.

yl09
04-07-2010, 09:56 AM
You should go read up before you made such comment....

SMU adopts the US Latin Cum Laude Honors System, which is different from the British Honors system.


I guessed I missed out the "british" word.

anyway i don't see why its difficult to get "honors" in smu. it depends on your gpa, so its really not that difficult to get "honors".

forrest
04-07-2010, 06:41 PM
I believe it's not a material concern, be it a Latin Cum Laude Honors System or British Honors system, it's just another way of 'assuring' the quality of the graduates since only the few best will receive 'first class' or 'magna cum laude'.

RightBrain
04-09-2010, 12:20 PM
On average, with honours, SMU's business graduates (http://www.moe.gov.sg/education/post-secondary/files/ges-smu.pdf)earn $3,336, NUS's business graduates (http://www.moe.gov.sg/education/post-secondary/files/ges-nus.pdf) earn $3,389 and NTU's business graduates (http://www.moe.gov.sg/education/post-secondary/files/ges-ntu.pdf)earn $2,754.

The starting salary of $2754 for NTU grads indicated above includes both honours and non-honours students.

Hence, it would be inaccurate to compare it with the starting salary of $3336 and $3389 of SMU honours and NUS honours students only.

If NTU had separated the statistics for its honours and non-honours students, you will probably see that the difference with SMU and NUS would not be that significant.

If you compare the 25th percentile salary among the 3 schools:

25th percentile of SMU (without honours) : $2400
25th percentile of NUS (without honours) : $2200
25th percentile of NTU : $2300

forrest
04-10-2010, 09:32 AM
Thanks for the information, I didn't know that NTU actually lumps two different groups of students together for the statistics. :)

Floun.Der
05-10-2010, 11:55 PM
Hi..
Im stil in a dilemma aft soo long n the deadline is nearing. Initially i tot SMU may b a good idea given its seminar styled teaching. but aft hearing tt it is going to b super competitive to get that honors aft 4 yrs i tink it may not b tt worth it to waste 4 yrs of my precious uni life all to work again (which is wat happened for the past 2 yrs in JC). im not implying tt i dun wan to work but rather i wan to work n yet able to enjoy sch life.

Now im considering NUS or NTU. Can anyone suggest which sch provides more opportunities in terms of internships n overseas exchanges? which sch provides more help for their students to find a job in a renowned company? I tink tts wat reali bothers me. i tink securing a job is more impt than the pay itself.

One can reali go crazy tinking bout wich sch to go to everyday. I WAN TO END THIS QUICK..

seeweiren
05-11-2010, 01:34 PM
Hi..
Im stil in a dilemma aft soo long n the deadline is nearing. Initially i tot SMU may b a good idea given its seminar styled teaching. but aft hearing tt it is going to b super competitive to get that honors aft 4 yrs i tink it may not b tt worth it to waste 4 yrs of my precious uni life all to work again (which is wat happened for the past 2 yrs in JC). im not implying tt i dun wan to work but rather i wan to work n yet able to enjoy sch life.

Now im considering NUS or NTU. Can anyone suggest which sch provides more opportunities in terms of internships n overseas exchanges? which sch provides more help for their students to find a job in a renowned company? I tink tts wat reali bothers me. i tink securing a job is more impt than the pay itself.

One can reali go crazy tinking bout wich sch to go to everyday. I WAN TO END THIS QUICK..

A simple solution: Get a university that is not in Singapore then, try getting degree from the European Countries;the students there are slack and chill.

If not, then don't complain, because this is Singapore. It's a country, where stress and competitive mugging is inevitable. What makes you think that getting an honor is harder in SMU, as compared to the other 2 universities?They are equally as competitive as SMU.

And do bear in mind that if you are intending to go for Intl Exchange, NUS and NTU have very stiff competition, because you are fighting with students from different faculties and also a large student population. If you think of securing a job is more important, then go for the learning style or the course structure which you think will prepare you well for that.

Each school has a strong career center which helps and provide opportunities for their students.

BTW,I am from SMU, but I am not here to promote my university.

For a start, go re-read the prospectus in the 3 universities, look at what major they can offer you, statistics, ranking whatever that determines your final decision.

gumm3rz
05-13-2010, 01:21 PM
hey I would like to ask if SMU accountancy recognised for admissions to MBA programmes in prestigious US universities?For NTU and NUS, they are definitely recognised right?

Floun.Der
05-13-2010, 09:48 PM
A simple solution: Get a university that is not in Singapore then, try getting degree from the European Countries;the students there are slack and chill.

If not, then don't complain, because this is Singapore. It's a country, where stress and competitive mugging is inevitable. What makes you think that getting an honor is harder in SMU, as compared to the other 2 universities?They are equally as competitive as SMU.

And do bear in mind that if you are intending to go for Intl Exchange, NUS and NTU have very stiff competition, because you are fighting with students from different faculties and also a large student population. If you think of securing a job is more important, then go for the learning style or the course structure which you think will prepare you well for that.

Each school has a strong career center which helps and provide opportunities for their students.

BTW,I am from SMU, but I am not here to promote my university.

For a start, go re-read the prospectus in the 3 universities, look at what major they can offer you, statistics, ranking whatever that determines your final decision.

i dun care about whether it is rigorous or not reali. but i tink NUS and NTU may provide more opportunities for internships n all that because they are more well-known n overseas companies and uni would approach them first for partnership n stuff. not that SMU doesnt hv tt kind of opportunities provided but I tink since it is a new uni, it may b reputable onli in singapore instead of abroad.

seeweiren
05-14-2010, 12:41 PM
i dun care about whether it is rigorous or not reali. but i tink NUS and NTU may provide more opportunities for internships n all that because they are more well-known n overseas companies and uni would approach them first for partnership n stuff. not that SMU doesnt hv tt kind of opportunities provided but I tink since it is a new uni, it may b reputable onli in singapore instead of abroad.

Sadly, you have not done your homework properly. If recognition and ranking is very important to you, the I will suggest you to consider NTU, since they are top in almost every business school ranking (Among all 3 universities). But if you are speaking about global visibility, then I am afraid to tell you that local universities are extremely under-rated. This means that despite how famous or how good we are, people from those overseas companies have no idea about how good our graduates are. But that being said, the 3 local uni certificate are just a qualification. When you go out there it's a diffferent world, people are not going to care if you are from NTU,NUS or SMU. They do look at your GPA and your results yes, but they will also see how productive you are.

SMU might be reputable only in Singapore instead of abroad? I do not have statistics for that, but I do know of seniors who were chosen and working abroad now. Many for a start a guy just got an investment banking job in Hong Kong. Another is working in a consultancy firm in the States.

As for internship, it's either you fight hard to source for yourself, or you have a great support from your career service centre. Just for you info, The ratio of students to student population studying/working/interning abroad in SMU is probably higher than the other 2 universities, because we have a low student population as compared to the other 2. :)

slayercsa
05-14-2010, 02:48 PM
Hey Hey! I really need yours opinions on this decision of mine. Pls give me your most constructive/honest opinions.

Right now SMU and NUS offered Biz, and after reading and researching on the internet, I still can't decide between the 2, which is better? One moment I am swaying towards SMU, the other moment I am swaying towards NUS. :confused:

PS: I looking forward to major in marketing or HR.

Exemptions
I'm a poly graduate, but not from a related diploma field. Hence, which school allows exemptions ? NUS allows exemptions for electives, whereas SMU did not have much information in this aspect.

Career Services
I heard of stories of both schools having excellent career offices, helping students with internships/finding jobs upon graduation. However, what I am more concern is that are the jobs available sufficient for all students? Or are they only sufficient for the top xx% students? Does the career offices in both school also help to find jobs for the average students? Or are the average students left alone to fend for themselves.

Specialization
I read somewhere that NUS is a general biz degree as in NUS, it is not necessary to declare a major. So if a biz degree is already very general, does a NUS BBA make it even more general? Like they say, jack of all trades, but master of none. Is that a good thing or a bad thing?
Meanwhile most students in SMU have 2 majors, something which I am aiming for. In addition, SMU students graduate with a Bachelor in BM ( your major). Is that beneficial in finding jobs?

Competitive-ness
Indeed, I read through that SMU is very competitive. People hiding their GPAs as they fear getting backstabbed. Students come to lessons prepared albeit first day of school. Midnight oils are burn day in day out.
In addition, the bell curve in SMU is among the students in ur seminar room, so around 20+ ppl? So that will make it alot more competitive?
So am I correct to say that SMU is indeed more competitive than NUS? As I haven't heard of anyone saying NUS is very competitive, so I will appreciate it if someone can tell me how competitive NUS is like. :)

Honours
It take 4 years to graduate with a good degree from both unis.
From NUS FAQ:
50% of the students proceed towards honour years, while 40% of the students graduated with honours.

can't find any information about SMU: Will appreciate it if someone can estimate the percentage of SMU graduates who got honours. ( or whatever they call it in SMU :p)

And what about the value of honours? Since both school are using a different systems, it is difficult to compare them directly. Is there any ways to compare if a Cumm Laude is more value than a Second Lower or what?

Poly Students Population

NUS is refer to as the JC heaven, NTU is called the poly heaven.
So what is SMU? What's like the poly population in SMU? Or is it also mostly JC students?

After-school hours

Generally what do students like to do in both schools? I not exactly a party-goer. Doesn't club, doesn't drink much. However, neither am I those who go home after school to play computer/study. I prefer to go out walk, just hanging out and chilling. I want a place where am I able to fit in without being a fake me.

Tuition Fees

SMU fees are much more expensive, $2400 more annually compared to NUS, $9600 total for 4 years. In addition, located in town area the food is much more expensive too. Anyone in SMU can give me a rough guide of your monthly living expenses?
In addition, NUS seems cheap, even cheaper if I choose not to do honours. Hostel fees does not concern me as I got a direct bus straight to the NUS Biz building.

I come from a middle income family, gross income/ capital is slightly above 1000. SMU fees might be hefty to me. I have though of scholarship, but my CCA records are not that good and the only thing that I can be proud of is my Diploma With Merit. But that alone isn't sufficient.

This point alone is enough to make me sway towards NUS. Is the amount of money spend on SMU fees justified?

Qualifying English Test

All poly applicants going NUS have to take the QET, while for SMU, I not sure about the QET. Is the QET the one which we took when we went for the interview?

Curriculum/Coursework

SMU lessons are seminar styles. What I want to know that what's the curriculum like in most modules? For SMU is it like group projects all the way with some exam papers?

For NUS, what is it like? I read that some lessons are held in seminar styles, while there are also alot of projects. But are projects mostly individual or groupwork? In addition, the idea of a thesis really make me dislike it.

Is it a norm to memorise lots of theories,squeeze the whole of finance law in both NUS or SMU?
I am one who like to do groupwork, and also study by understanding concepts, not squeezing everything inside and unleashing it during exams.

slayercsa
05-15-2010, 09:55 PM
2 weeks before deadline, and yes I am desperate to come to a decision.

I posted here, but this topic is rather inactive, so I posted a new topic here instead.

Actual topic:
http://forum.brightsparks.com.sg/showthread.php?t=2835


Right now SMU and NUS offered Biz, and after reading and researching on the internet, I still can't decide between the 2, which is better? One moment I am swaying towards SMU, the other moment I am swaying towards NUS. :confused:

PS: I looking forward to major in marketing or HR.

Exemptions
I'm a poly graduate, but not from a related diploma field. Hence, which school allows exemptions ? NUS allows exemptions for electives, whereas SMU did not have much information in this aspect.

Career Services
I heard of stories of both schools having excellent career offices, helping students with internships/finding jobs upon graduation. However, what I am more concern is that are the jobs available sufficient for all students? Or are they only sufficient for the top xx% students? Does the career offices in both school also help to find jobs for the average students? Or are the average students left alone to fend for themselves.

Specialization
I read somewhere that NUS is a general biz degree as in NUS, it is not necessary to declare a major. So if a biz degree is already very general, does a NUS BBA make it even more general? Like they say, jack of all trades, but master of none. Is that a good thing or a bad thing?
Meanwhile most students in SMU have 2 majors, something which I am aiming for. In addition, SMU students graduate with a Bachelor in BM ( your major). Is that beneficial in finding jobs?

Competitive-ness
Indeed, I read through that SMU is very competitive. People hiding their GPAs as they fear getting backstabbed. Students come to lessons prepared albeit first day of school. Midnight oils are burn day in day out. So am I correct to say that SMU is indeed more competitive than NUS? As I haven't heard of anyone saying NUS is very competitive, so I will appreciate it if someone can tell me how competitive NUS is like. :)

Honours
It take 4 years to graduate with a good degree from both unis.
From NUS FAQ:
50% of the students proceed towards honour years, while 40% of the students graduated with honours.

can't find any information about SMU: Will appreciate it if someone can estimate the percentage of SMU graduates who got honours. ( or whatever they call it in SMU :p)

Poly Students Population

NUS is refer to as the JC heaven, NTU is called the poly heaven.
So what is SMU? What's like the poly population in SMU? Or is it also mostly JC students?

After-school hours

Generally what do students like to do in both schools? I not exactly a party-goer. Doesn't club, doesn't drink much. However, neither am I those who go home after school to play computer/study. I prefer to go out walk, just hanging out and chilling. I want a place where am I able to fit in without being a fake me.

Tuition Fees

SMU fees are much more expensive, $2400 more annually compared to NUS, $9600 total for 4 years. In addition, located in town area the food is much more expensive too. Anyone in SMU can give me a rough guide of your monthly living expenses?
In addition, NUS seems cheap, even cheaper if I choose not to do honours. Hostel fees does not concern me as I got a direct bus straight to the NUS Biz building.

I come from a middle income family, gross income/ capital is slightly above 1000. SMU fees might be hefty to me. I have though of scholarship, but my CCA records are not that good and the only thing that I can be proud of is my Diploma With Merit. But that alone isn't sufficient.

This point alone is enough to make me sway towards NUS. Is the amount of money spend on SMU fees justified?

Qualifying English Test

All poly applicants going NUS have to take the QET, while for SMU, I not sure about the QET. Is the QET the one which we took when we went for the interview?

Curriculum/Coursework

SMU lessons are seminar styles. What I want to know that what's the curriculum like in most modules? For SMU is it like group projects all the way with some exam papers?

For NUS, what is it like? I read that some lessons are held in seminar styles, while there are also alot of projects. But are projects mostly individual or groupwork? In addition, the idea of a thesis really make me dislike it.

Is it a norm to memorise lots of theories,squeeze the whole of finance law in both NUS or SMU?
I am one who like to do groupwork, and also study by understanding concepts, not squeezing everything inside and unleashing it during exams.

Slavor
05-17-2010, 01:19 PM
I'm facing the same quandary as Slayercsa, choosing between NUS and SMU biz.

I would like to ask, how is the culture in NUS/SMU like? Does the lack of a big campus space make SMU a less ideal place to hang out with friends there (I know town is nearby and all but let's leave it out of consideration)?

I asked a staff member in NUS, and apparently all year 1 modules are lecture based. It is from year 2 onwards that seminar style classes are held, although the lady could not confirm that all classes from year 2 onwards were seminar style. Which to me is important, as I vastly prefer the more engaging experience of seminar style learning...

Props to Slayercsa for writing out a post which has most of my questions too! ^^

slayercsa
05-17-2010, 02:20 PM
I'm facing the same quandary as Slayercsa, choosing between NUS and SMU biz.

I would like to ask, how is the culture in NUS/SMU like? Does the lack of a big campus space make SMU a less ideal place to hang out with friends there (I know town is nearby and all but let's leave it out of consideration)?

I asked a staff member in NUS, and apparently all year 1 modules are lecture based. It is from year 2 onwards that seminar style classes are held, although the lady could not confirm that all classes from year 2 onwards were seminar style. Which to me is important, as I vastly prefer the more engaging experience of seminar style learning...

Props to Slayercsa for writing out a post which has most of my questions too! ^^

no problem. haha.

but apparently no one is answering it :( :(

Slavor
05-17-2010, 02:59 PM
Yea, hopefully students who are in NUS/SMU can reply.

Although for me my main concerns are the culture, campus and teaching style of both universities. I would enjoy a more friendly culture, bigger campus and engaging style of teaching. Which gives me a headache to choose between NUS or SMU...

slayercsa
05-17-2010, 04:19 PM
Yea, hopefully students who are in NUS/SMU can reply.

Although for me my main concerns are the culture, campus and teaching style of both universities. I would enjoy a more friendly culture, bigger campus and engaging style of teaching. Which gives me a headache to choose between NUS or SMU...


haha. i think smu is less friendly as it seems to be more competitive.

my main concerns are the theoretical part and the honours part.

fireflyhigh
05-19-2010, 12:20 AM
A simple solution: Get a university that is not in Singapore then, try getting degree from the European Countries;the students there are slack and chill.

If not, then don't complain, because this is Singapore. It's a country, where stress and competitive mugging is inevitable. What makes you think that getting an honor is harder in SMU, as compared to the other 2 universities?They are equally as competitive as SMU.

And do bear in mind that if you are intending to go for Intl Exchange, NUS and NTU have very stiff competition, because you are fighting with students from different faculties and also a large student population. If you think of securing a job is more important, then go for the learning style or the course structure which you think will prepare you well for that.

Each school has a strong career center which helps and provide opportunities for their students.

BTW,I am from SMU, but I am not here to promote my university.

For a start, go re-read the prospectus in the 3 universities, look at what major they can offer you, statistics, ranking whatever that determines your final decision.

Chill la my friend. hahaa. In my tiny world, NUS, NTU and SMU business school are more or less the same on quality. Each university is very competitive and everyone is equally hard to survive.

Of course, I'm totally agree with your statement that "this is Singapore, It's a country, where stress and competitive mugging is inevitable".
hhaaa, you should know better ma. Singaporeans love to compare things.

We love to compare who got more branded shirts.
We love to compare who goes to JC/Poly/ITE.
We love to compare who got more shinier shoes.
:DWe love to compare who have posher car.
:DWe love to compare who have prettier gf with more hour-glass figure.
:DWe even love to compare whose underwears are more branded.

hahaaa, just chill. this is our country, and this is our unique culture.
its inevitable that people would compare NTU NUS and SMU.

as people wants to compare, compare lo. but at the end of the day, regardless of the biased ranking, nus ntu and smu, in my tiny world, are of good assured quality educational university.:D

Slavor
05-19-2010, 06:30 PM
I'm headed for the SMU's tea session this Saturday. Hopefully the students there can help me to make an informed decision; I'm still quite undecided between NUS and SMU biz...

gumm3rz
05-20-2010, 01:59 AM
i'll repost this again

hey I would like to ask if SMU accountancy recognised for admissions to MBA programmes in prestigious US universities?For NTU and NUS, they are definitely recognised right?

slayercsa
05-20-2010, 09:28 AM
i'll repost this again

hey I would like to ask if SMU accountancy recognised for admissions to MBA programmes in prestigious US universities?For NTU and NUS, they are definitely recognised right?

i'm not sure about ntu. Cause most MBA in prestigious unis only recognise bachelors with 4 years as an undergraduate. So for NTU cases, they might close one eye.

seeweiren
05-20-2010, 11:32 PM
i'm not sure about ntu. Cause most MBA in prestigious unis only recognise bachelors with 4 years as an undergraduate. So for NTU cases, they might close one eye.

NTU follows the commonwealth system. This means it will naturally be accepted as a bachelor degree with direct honors even though it's a 3 year program. It's similar to most UK uni's degree which offer a 3 years direct honors program.

HappyGoLucky
05-24-2010, 02:26 PM
hey I would like to ask if SMU accountancy recognised for admissions to MBA programmes in prestigious US universities?For NTU and NUS, they are definitely recognised right?

Do note that recognition and preference are two separate issues. There are many universities that are recognised but there are only a handful which are preferred. If you plan to apply for a first-tier programme, what you should be asking about is preference, not recognition.

gumm3rz
05-24-2010, 03:32 PM
Do note that recognition and preference are two separate issues. There are many universities that are recognised but there are only a handful which are preferred. If you plan to apply for a first-tier programme, what you should be asking about is preference, not recognition.

ohh how are the two(preference and recognition)different?care to enlighten me?and so which will be preferred?does admissions to US prestigious MBA programmes depend a lot on rankings of the school that a person previously attended?or is it more dependent on the students' abilities?eg that can be assessed through personal statements, interviews and past achievements.

nixgnibknn
05-25-2010, 03:47 AM
I am offered with both NUS Business Administration and SMU BBM. And i am currently very undecided on where to go, despite the deadline drawing near. I really appreciate any seniors currently in SMU to step forward to address our concerns.

Honestly, i have always been very keen on going SMU, due to its unique pedagogy of its seminar-styled teaching. However i have read in forums and heard remarks about the mugger culture in SMU which seems rather extreme, and i was wondering if such an extreme competitive culture would do more good to the student or harm? I have heard of several projects being heaped onto students, and they have to work on them 24/7, having practically little time for themselves.

On the other hand, NUS business course seems to develop capable graduates at their own pace and it seems a like more vibrant place to be in, even though SMU markets itself for its vibrancy. Is it true that NUS adopts the rewarding system, whereas SMU adopts the penalising system (where they frighten students with lousy grades to force them to improve)

Due to financial reasons, i do not intend to stay in the NUS Hall. Will this cause me to miss out on a big part of the student life than NUS has always been promoting?

I have read on other threads and heard from my seniors about the glitz and glamour of the SMU students (to be exact, girls). They don make-up when they go to school and there is peer pressure to be well-dressed and be glamourous. I personally feel that there is nothing wrong with wearing make up and dressing up well, but is the peer pressure really that significant?

Another huge question in my mind, IS SMU REALLY ALL TALK AND NO SUBSTANCE. given that NUS is putting greater emphasis on class participation and project work, should i choose NUS instead which is well known for its intensive curriculum and deep rigour? How do current undergrads find their curriculum to be like. I have heard it is just the teaching style of SMU professors who probably want their students to be more independent in their learning so they do not just spoonfeed their students with information and allow them to absorb info like sponges. However, will students be disadvantaged if they are hardworking at finding information, but they just dont know what are the right sources. i believe that ground knowledge is also as important as walking the talk. can smu graduates also come forth to testify if their education in SMU has prepared them sufficiently (knowledge wise) to handle whatever they are doing in their job scope. or is it true that what we learn in university cannot be really applied in our jobs next time, it is more like on-the-job-learning?

Also, i wonder if its true that there will be more overseas opportunities and exchange programmes in NUS compared to SMU due to its long history and deep connections with overseas partnership universities?

In addition, NUS and SMU have each organised their own tea sessions and masterclasses. Comparing the seniors from both universities during the respective tea sessions, I feel that NUS student ambassadors come across as more helpful. They exchanged numbers with me and up till now, they have been trying their best to answer any queries i have with regards to the NUS culure/syllabus/curriculum etc. SMU senior ambasadors seem rather passive, and some even hijacked their own school's reputation. One of the senior told me her honest feelings that she isn't enjoying herself in the school and that the main reason she is struggling on is to get herself a good job in the future. Stress threshold levels are subjective and i should take her words with a pinch of salt. However after all the feedback i have collected, SMU now seems rather intimidating, even though i wanted to get into SMU so much back then.

Another SMU senior's reply to my queries was even worse: eh knn, i just reached singapore and i don't feel like answering your questions. I sincerely hope not all smu seniors are like that and this is futher ruining my perception of smu which has already an unfriendly and political culture to begin with. Will NUS be a better place to be in, with friendly competition and less backstabbing, although it doesnt reflect the real corporate world, but at least it is a transition stage where we can adapt slowly.

I have several friends who have chosen NUS over SMU due to the above concerns. I do not want to regret not choosing SMU as i have always felt that SMU is an awfully great school to be in.

I reaaaaaaaaaalllly hope that SMU current seniors can come forth and testify for their school's learning environment (whether it is conducive enough etc) and culture. this would be good as this can help to clear any misunderstandings as well.

the deadline is coming. i am currently still clueless to where i am going. probably i am still biased towards SMU but there are still concerns holding me back. the Language Preparation Programme in NUS is really enticing as well. it is honestly a hard choice between the two universities. i hope there are some kind souls who will give me their two cents worth!

on a separate note, i believe all prospective students going to university wish for a fulfilling time in university, with a balance life of both studying hard and playing hard. of course, i want to be a graduate who it is capable of presenting myself well with confidence. and i wonder do i really need SMU style of teaching to be what i want to become. Also, the university i want to attend should have an excellent career office which help its students to attain their desired prestigious internships and overseas opportunities. these will be the last few years of our student life, and we really want them to be remembered as happy times, instead of a nightmare.

seeweiren
05-25-2010, 09:24 AM
I am offered with both NUS Business Administration and SMU BBM. And i am currently very undecided on where to go, despite the deadline drawing near. I really appreciate any seniors currently in SMU to step forward to address our concerns.

Honestly, i have always been very keen on going SMU, due to its unique pedagogy of its seminar-styled teaching. However i have read in forums and heard remarks about the mugger culture in SMU which seems rather extreme, and i was wondering if such an extreme competitive culture would do more good to the student or harm? I have heard of several projects being heaped onto students, and they have to work on them 24/7, having practically little time for themselves.

On the other hand, NUS business course seems to develop capable graduates at their own pace and it seems a like more vibrant place to be in, even though SMU markets itself for its vibrancy. Is it true that NUS adopts the rewarding system, whereas SMU adopts the penalising system (where they frighten students with lousy grades to force them to improve)

Due to financial reasons, i do not intend to stay in the NUS Hall. Will this cause me to miss out on a big part of the student life than NUS has always been promoting?

I have read on other threads and heard from my seniors about the glitz and glamour of the SMU students (to be exact, girls). They don make-up when they go to school and there is peer pressure to be well-dressed and be glamourous. I personally feel that there is nothing wrong with wearing make up and dressing up well, but is the peer pressure really that significant?

Another huge question in my mind, IS SMU REALLY ALL TALK AND NO SUBSTANCE. given that NUS is putting greater emphasis on class participation and project work, should i choose NUS instead which is well known for its intensive curriculum and deep rigour? How do current undergrads find their curriculum to be like. I have heard it is just the teaching style of SMU professors who probably want their students to be more independent in their learning so they do not just spoonfeed their students with information and allow them to absorb info like sponges. However, will students be disadvantaged if they are hardworking at finding information, but they just dont know what are the right sources. i believe that ground knowledge is also as important as walking the talk. can smu graduates also come forth to testify if their education in SMU has prepared them sufficiently (knowledge wise) to handle whatever they are doing in their job scope. or is it true that what we learn in university cannot be really applied in our jobs next time, it is more like on-the-job-learning?

Also, i wonder if its true that there will be more overseas opportunities and exchange programmes in NUS compared to SMU due to its long history and deep connections with overseas partnership universities?

In addition, NUS and SMU have each organised their own tea sessions and masterclasses. Comparing the seniors from both universities during the respective tea sessions, I feel that NUS student ambassadors come across as more helpful. They exchanged numbers with me and up till now, they have been trying their best to answer any queries i have with regards to the NUS culure/syllabus/curriculum etc. SMU senior ambasadors seem rather passive, and some even hijacked their own school's reputation. One of the senior told me her honest feelings that she isn't enjoying herself in the school and that the main reason she is struggling on is to get herself a good job in the future. Stress threshold levels are subjective and i should take her words with a pinch of salt. However after all the feedback i have collected, SMU now seems rather intimidating, even though i wanted to get into SMU so much back then.

Another SMU senior's reply to my queries was even worse: eh knn, i just reached singapore and i don't feel like answering your questions. I sincerely hope not all smu seniors are like that and this is futher ruining my perception of smu which has already an unfriendly and political culture to begin with. Will NUS be a better place to be in, with friendly competition and less backstabbing, although it doesnt reflect the real corporate world, but at least it is a transition stage where we can adapt slowly.

I have several friends who have chosen NUS over SMU due to the above concerns. I do not want to regret not choosing SMU as i have always felt that SMU is an awfully great school to be in.

I reaaaaaaaaaalllly hope that SMU current seniors can come forth and testify for their school's learning environment (whether it is conducive enough etc) and culture. this would be good as this can help to clear any misunderstandings as well.

the deadline is coming. i am currently still clueless to where i am going. probably i am still biased towards SMU but there are still concerns holding me back. the Language Preparation Programme in NUS is really enticing as well. it is honestly a hard choice between the two universities. i hope there are some kind souls who will give me their two cents worth!

on a separate note, i believe all prospective students going to university wish for a fulfilling time in university, with a balance life of both studying hard and playing hard. of course, i want to be a graduate who it is capable of presenting myself well with confidence. and i wonder do i really need SMU style of teaching to be what i want to become. Also, the university i want to attend should have an excellent career office which help its students to attain their desired prestigious internships and overseas opportunities. these will be the last few years of our student life, and we really want them to be remembered as happy times, instead of a nightmare.

There you go, I wrote this 1 year ago. Probably I should renew the content and add more content.Hmmmm.

http://forum.brightsparks.com.sg/showthread.php?t=3257

Fb or Skype me if u want to know more about SMU. Same username as the one in brightsparks.And another advise, don't bother about what the outside world is talking. Choose something which you want and holds dearly.

linteng
05-25-2010, 11:50 AM
Hi guys. I'm also a poly student with offers from 3 universities but I have narrowed my choices to either NTU Business or SMU Business. To be honest, I'm more of a hand-on kind of person - preferring project work over examinations. But i understand that exams and test are part and parcel of the education system so I'm not going to be basing my criteria primarily on that issue. I have yet to decide which Uni at this point in time (which is like about 7 days to decision). I'm caught in a dilemma currently and I need to make a decision quick. I've read weiren's take on SMU but have yet to hear from NTU students.


Poly Students Population

NUS is refer to as the JC heaven, NTU is called the poly heaven.
So what is SMU? What's like the poly population in SMU? Or is it also mostly JC students?


And btw, why is NTU a heaven for poly students? On what basis did you say that? If I'm not mistaken, SMU has lots of RJC and VJC students. If there are people that feel threatened by them (although they shouldn't), then in my opinion I tink it is better to stay away from SMU.

Stuplexy
05-25-2010, 11:56 AM
Hi guys. I'm also a poly student with offers from 3 universities but I have narrowed my choices to either NTU Business or SMU Business. To be honest, I'm more of a hand-on kind of person - preferring project work over examinations. But i understand that exams and test are part and parcel of the education system so I'm not going to be basing my criteria primarily on that issue. I have yet to decide which Uni at this point in time (which is like about 7 days to decision). I'm caught in a dilemma currently and I need to make a decision quick. I've read weiren's take on SMU but have yet to hear from NTU students.



And btw, why is NTU a heaven for poly students? On what basis did you say that? If I'm not mistaken, SMU has lots of RJC and VJC students. If there are people that feel threatened by them (although they shouldn't), then in my opinion I tink it is better to stay away from SMU.



I'm have the same dilemma as you, NTU vs SMU. But my main concern is the quality of professors. Does SMU have more professors with better qualifications? Especially the finance side?

linteng
05-25-2010, 12:25 PM
SMU have always emphasized that they have always adopted a different teaching approach as compared to the other Universities. Credentials-wise, I think all Unis are the same. The USP of SMU is that they have a different approach to how they teach their students, which I believe is similar to the poly system (to a certain extent). NTU has the history and reputation and has the bragging rights for being one of the best business school in this region.

The 3-year direct honors is really an incentive to me. Not to mention the less expensive tuition fees is a plus as well.

mwahahaha
05-26-2010, 09:56 AM
i am having the same dilemma as nixgnibknn. and the deadline is coming.

can linteng and stuplexy share why u guys are not considering NUS? :)

linteng
05-26-2010, 10:22 AM
i am having the same dilemma as nixgnibknn. and the deadline is coming.

can linteng and stuplexy share why u guys are not considering NUS? :)

Haha. I'm just going to say my piece. My opinions are purely for reference and might be biased. Take them with a pinch of salt. =]

Firstly, I did some research and asked some of my friends and came to the conclusion that NUS is no longer the prestigious tertiary institute I used to know. Seemingly, NUS graduates receive very little support from the school itself with regards to internships and securing the first job. One may argue that graduates should be independent and stuff like that but in the world of business, networking is very very important. From what I see, NUS seems like a Uni that prepares their graduates for further education. And currently I'm not interested in pursuing a doctorate.

Secondly, my first choice was NUS business administration. But I was offered my second choice (FASS; I cannot rmb if that was my 2nd or 3rd choice). Not that I'm not interested ( I wouldn't mind reading economics/psychology) but I have doubts with regards to their selection criteria. #1: There were no interviews conducted to evaluate the applicants which I believe is a simple but essential step to gauge the capabilities of the students. #2: My GPA should be sufficient enough to secure a position in the school (based on last year data), and even if there were a revision of admission criteria, the difference wouldn't be so big that I'm kept out of the 10 percentile.

These are actually just 2 of the many reasons that had got me to strike out NUS as one of the choices although I must admit, branding myself as an NUS graduate reflects very well in my resume XD! Haha. In short, I feel NUS' way of handling the applicants and graduates are no longer relevant to the current environment and gradually might lose out to NTU and SMU (only for business-related degrees).

Remember, the choice is ultimately ours to make and my opinions are actually based on my own set of criteria. Of course there has got to be advantages when it comes to NUS but from the way I see it, the first point is good enough to strike NUS off my choices.

slayercsa
05-27-2010, 09:47 AM
SMU vs NUS for me.

Chosen SMU

mwahahaha
05-27-2010, 02:26 PM
QUOTING FROM FLOWERPOD:

Having graduated from SMU, I do find that the finance modules grossly lacking in rigor. I felt that taking 3 modules (for the elective component, sans the required Corp. Reportign and Fin.Instruments, Institutions and Markets) was just liek taking Fnce 101. No difference in the level of difficulty and there was a lot of overlap. Yawn.
I personally find that the modules like
-Tech and World Change
-Creative Thinking
-Analytical Skills
-Leadership (and the list goes on)
particularly dumb and f-ing waste time.

------------------------------------

to slayercsa, u not afraid that smu curriculum not deep enough meh??? :eek:

Stuplexy
05-27-2010, 02:55 PM
QUOTING FROM FLOWERPOD:

Having graduated from SMU, I do find that the finance modules grossly lacking in rigor. I felt that taking 3 modules (for the elective component, sans the required Corp. Reportign and Fin.Instruments, Institutions and Markets) was just liek taking Fnce 101. No difference in the level of difficulty and there was a lot of overlap. Yawn.
I personally find that the modules like
-Tech and World Change
-Creative Thinking
-Analytical Skills
-Leadership (and the list goes on)
particularly dumb and f-ing waste time.

------------------------------------

to slayercsa, u not afraid that smu curriculum not deep enough meh??? :eek:

Tbh, I find that those modules listed are important. It depends on the individual. To me, academics are important but so are leadership skills and coming up with creative solutions.

mwahahaha
05-27-2010, 03:35 PM
Tbh, I find that those modules listed are important. It depends on the individual. To me, academics are important but so are leadership skills and coming up with creative solutions.

r u also saying that nus will not help its students develop leadership skills and come up with creative solutions??

just want to exchange opinions, no offence intended :D

mwahahaha
05-27-2010, 03:47 PM
Haha. I'm just going to say my piece. My opinions are purely for reference and might be biased. Take them with a pinch of salt. =]

Firstly, I did some research and asked some of my friends and came to the conclusion that NUS is no longer the prestigious tertiary institute I used to know. Seemingly, NUS graduates receive very little support from the school itself with regards to internships and securing the first job. One may argue that graduates should be independent and stuff like that but in the world of business, networking is very very important.

in fact i have heard nus career office has improved a lot after poaching the career office people from smu ;) so i feel that both nus and smu career offices are equally fantastic at networking with prospective employers and helping its students get goood internships :)

I DUNNO. i chose nus. so naturally a lil biased towards nus :P

Stuplexy
05-27-2010, 03:59 PM
r u also saying that nus will not help its students develop leadership skills and come up with creative solutions??

just want to exchange opinions, no offence intended :D

They put quite alot of focus on it. Went for smu talk before, experienced the creative thinking module. Professor was very engaging and fun. So I liked it cos it got me thinking alot.

It is only natural that NUS and NTU are more academic, so its not their focus area.

Anyway does NUS offer such modules? Just wondering.

Yeap no offence taken. I want to learn more too (:

mwahahaha
05-27-2010, 04:50 PM
They put quite alot of focus on it. Went for smu talk before, experienced the creative thinking module. Professor was very engaging and fun. So I liked it cos it got me thinking alot.

It is only natural that NUS and NTU are more academic, so its not their focus area.

Anyway does NUS offer such modules? Just wondering.

Yeap no offence taken. I want to learn more too (:

NUS modules: http://bschool.nus.edu.sg/NUSBBA/UndergraduateDegrees/ModulesDescription.aspx#BFS1001

if u just compare the finance modules alone, it is evident that nus modules r more indepth. factually nus is more academic. i am just a tad worried that smu's syllabus may not prepare students well enough! and hence it may not be worth it to go smu aft paying such exorbitant school fees + matriculation fees ($200).

soft skills can also be developed through ccas and other activities. moreover, there is a greater emphasis on class participation in nus courses alr. a talk with nus finance prof revealed that her classes had 35% of grades reliant on class participation. also, nus emphasised that its career office is good now, has smu's-finishing-touch-equivalent courses in nus to develop students eq.

so wld u say nus prepares students in both aspects? academically and soft skills wise?

seeweiren
05-28-2010, 09:18 AM
NUS modules: http://bschool.nus.edu.sg/NUSBBA/UndergraduateDegrees/ModulesDescription.aspx#BFS1001

If u just compare the finance modules alone, it is evident that nus modules r more indepth. factually nus is more academic. i am just a tad worried that smu's syllabus may not prepare students well enough! and hence it may not be worth it to go smu aft paying such exorbitant school fees + matriculation fees ($200).

soft skills can also be developed through ccas and other activities. moreover, there is a greater emphasis on class participation in nus courses alr. a talk with nus finance prof revealed that her classes had 35% of grades reliant on class participation. also, nus emphasised that its career office is good now, has smu's-finishing-touch-equivalent courses in nus to develop students eq.

so wld u say nus prepares students in both aspects? academically and soft skills wise?

Sadly the above comment might be an overstatement. SMU's syllabus are taught by top professions and faculty members across renowned universities. As for Corp-reporting and Investment Banking Modules, there's a ex-top investment banker( I am not sure if he's still one) teaching this modules.

It's true that NUS is probably more academic, and theory focused, so to speak (I might be stereotyping). But one might question why are they trying to shift their strategy and focus, "following" the SMU unique seminar-learning model. Well that means what SMU has been doing for the past 10 years make sense, and there should be changes in Business School.

It's sad that NUS finance major lacks the competitiveness as compared to NTU and SMU, because they allow student to take any of the 6 finance electives, without any clear focus. The difference is that NTU and SMU is able to capture the job market demand, and introduce financial track; finance is a very broad field, which ranges from Insurance, Corp Finance to Risk Management. NUS seems to only have finance as a major (too general). While NTU and SMU introduce tracks like Risk Management, Wealth Management, Investment Banking track, to ensure student are well equipped before graduation. Next, NUS Business school do not seems to have other exotic field in more in-depth Finance like Mathematical Finance (QF). To study Quantitative Finance, you have to go to the School of Mathematics, not NUS business school. NTU offers Actuarial Science, while SMU offers it in the School of Economics, something which NUS is lagging behind.

Judging from the number of options to major, NUS sort of loses out to the other 2 Business school in that aspect.

I have friends from the NUS business school as well, and they are equally good,competitive and aggressive towards their studies. However, after 2 years of studies, you realise that NUS Business school should really encourage their students to speak more often. It's something which is still lagging in NUS Business school. I can sense the clear significant difference between the training I been through as compared to theirs. Not that NUS business school is bad or SMU is forever the best, it's just that SMU curriculum seems to be able to develop most of its graduates in a way where it's slightly higher in demand in the industries.

linteng
05-31-2010, 01:35 PM
Saw this on one of the forum posts and decided to post it up.

http://www.transitioning.org/2010/04/07/graduate-employment-survey-2009-published-2010-salary-sg/

marcus
06-02-2010, 08:35 PM
Dear interested applicants into the NUS Business School,

I have just completed a fun and fulfilling first year in the NUS Business School. However, while browsing through the BrightSparks Forum, I noticed that there were many applicants who were still musing about which faculty and which university to choose. I wished I have had the opportunity to post this earlier, but I have been really busy with my internship recently. Nonetheless, I hope that my account will give the potential applicants a better idea of what to expect for their first year here.

1) Recognition - NUS is a renowned top-notch university, ranked 3rd in Asia in the recently announced QS AUR rankings. This facilitates the pursuit of both future education opportunities and employment prospects, especially in foreign countries. Furthermore, our faculty's rankings are equally stellar as well. While rankings are not everything, they are nonetheless important to me, since I intend to pursue a MBA in future, and am also considering working in a foreign country should the opportunity arise in future.

2) Varsity Life - You are the master of your own life, and you structure it accordingly. For me, university life is about studying hard and playing hard at the same time, AND doing the things I always wanted to do. I joined various orientation camps where you really partied hard, got to make new friends and form lifelong friendships, and most importantly learn from the seniors. It was from such camps as well as networking sessions (e.g. Bizconnect) voluntarily organized by seniors in the school where I learnt countless tips such as the different approach needed to ‘tackle’ each module, as well as receiving past year notes from them. I am not so sure about the culture in other universities or faculties, but the seniors here are really helpful and even take the initiative to assist the students. This could perhaps be attested to our strong and cohesive spirit within the faculty – The Business School has consistently won the annual Rag and Flag among the many other faculties within NUS.

Subsequently, I took up leadership positions in the Faculty Club (student union), became an alumni group leader (Think: life-long Class Representative), AIESEC (the largest youth-led organization in the world), and am currently staying in Hall. I wanted to have fun, gain leadership skills and contribute back to both the faculty as well as society just like how the many seniors before me have done. You may have different objectives from me, but you will be spoilt for choices since we have the luxury of having the most clubs and societies by virtue of the university’s critical mass.

3) Faculty Staff Members - You will always hear both positive and negative comments about staff members, be it NUS or any other universities in the world. But in my honest opinion, I have met really good lecturers and tutors who are extremely dedicated to their job and go the extra mile to help the students. Bear in mind that it is not merely a one-semester relationship between the students and the professors. Many of my senior friends have enlisted the help of their past professors to advise them in their Consulting Practicum (Think: Group work to advise a company) and their Honors Thesis. Also, the staff members in the Office of Undergraduate Studies and Student Life are so earnest, helpful and friendly that you can walk in the office without nary an inhibition on expressing your concerns!

4) Overseas Exchange - There are so many universities to choose from, and many of them are top-notch too (e.g. NYU Stern). Best of all... it is subsidized! Most of the students are eligible, and do in fact, go for an overseas exchange. Personally, I am looking forward to my exchange at Peking University next year!

5) Internships - The career service office in our school has been actively sourcing for internships for the students. Indeed, we frequently get mailers inviting us to apply for top internships including Goldman, JPMorgan, UBS and Citigroup, while the accounting students pursue internships at the Big 4. Not only do they do an excellent job in sourcing for these internship opportunities (almost every single student in the school will do at least one internship before graduating), but they also have frequent talks from various industry professionals as well as conducting interviewing clinics etc. Our career counselors devote their attention to every single student and nurture them to reach their full potential. Even the freshman are encouraged to apply for internships to companies which may be less glamorous than some traditional blue-chip firms, provide the students with good experience and future leverage for future internship opportunities. To attest to this fact, I am currently doing a Citibank internship now.

6) Job opportunities - The statistics speak for themselves. We have the highest % of graduates who find a permanent job.

7) Peers - All of your friends will be very competent and academically qualified - just like any other top Business Schools. The IGP are easily available so I will not elaborate. But what I will be pleased to add is that we have developed a strong and cohesive culture where the people are extremely friendly, and there is no backstabbing. As for stress, I personally feel that it is part and parcel of university life, and the key is how you manage it and how much you want to succeed. Trust me, the stress is nothing compared to what you will experience when you go out to work, especially in professions where you are hard-pressed to meet the bottom-line.

8) Curriculum Depth and Flexibility – I will give a very brief description of the curriculum for you, just to give you all a rough idea of what to expect. You will all start off by doing a common core of modules that will take around 1.5 - 2 years, where you will obtain a wide range of general skill sets and knowledge. Subsequently, you will specialize in an area of interest (Finance, Marketing, Operations etc). Lastly, you have the further option to do a minor or another Major within the faculty (E.g. Accounting + Finance) or outside the faculty (Marketing + Economics) or even do more modules for your specialization than what is required. It really depends on whether you want to be extremely competent in your specialization area, or you prefer a broader but correlated set of skills. Furthermore, if you want to pursue other interests (or just simply adore studying), you can join the University Scholars Program, do a concurrent Masters, or join the double degree program where you will graduate with 2 degrees! Personally, I felt that both finance and economics are fields that are intricately woven, hence I will be pursuing a double degree in Business and Economics.

For those who are wondering whether the curriculum emphasizes on projects or exams, or whether the outspoken tend to excel, I will say that it is pretty much a harmonious balance. It is of course a trade-off (no curriculum can emphasize on projects without sacrificing on a lower emphasis for the final year exams), but I personally feel that our school has achieved a pleasant balance. This ensures that students who excel in group work would not feel marginalized (as they would, should the curriculum over focuses on the final year exams). Nonetheless, in general, project work gets progressively more important when you start your specialization. Class participation is also important, but the focus is on quality answers and not mere blabbering, hence the result is that the students tend to offer quality answers and their peers will chip in with alternative arguments or build on to the previous suggestion.

9) Misc (Case competitions, Quizzes, Overseas Colleges, Study Trips etc) - You basically choose how you want to enrich your life further, if you are still not satisfied with co-curricular activities, internships and overseas exchanges. The business school provides numerous opportunities for you to do so through Case competitions which hone your presentation skills, Quizzes where you gain analytical skills and Overseas Colleges where you can embark on a one-year stint in top universities (e.g. UPenn, Stanford) to work for start-ups and learn from entrepreneurs, while studying at the same time. Lastly, there is a plethora of summer programs and study trips to choose from, both university-wide and faculty-specific. For example, I have just returned from a China Business Trip (which was heavily subsidized and supported by the school), while my peers have embarked on Summer Programs in Beijing, Mexico etc. Also, I have participated and intend to participate further in quizzes as well.

10) Alumni Network - The faculty places heavy emphasis on promoting long-lasting alumni relations as well as building our alumni network which dates back a long long way. So even when you graduate, the school still actively maintains contact with you, as well as encouraging frequent meet-ups and contact with not only your fellow peers, but with other alumni members as well.

11) Talks - Distinguished Alumni members, Members of the Management Advisory Board and visiting professors / guests frequently come to the faculty to give talks and share their experiences. Occasionally, the students even get to visit their work places! For example, I have had the recent opportunity to engage in a dialogue session with Mr Dhanabalan at Temasek Holdings.

12) Facilities – There are of course, a wide range of facilities available for the students in NUS. I shall not elaborate them here. But I must debunk certain rumors that our faculty is found wanting on her facilities. In fact, we have just moved to a brand new building with really great facilities. There is even a Center for Asset Management Research and Investments there, and it contains a trading lab!

marcus
06-03-2010, 01:21 AM
I have elaborated at length on the wonderful opportunities that you get by choosing the NUS Business School. But I must state that such opportunities do not come knocking on the door. The school puts in quite a bit of effort to make such opportunities available for the students, but at the end of the day, it is the onus on the students to plan his/her career path and take advantage of these opportunities. The school could provide a potpourri of internship opportunities, subsidize study trips, set up trading labs and organize dialogues, but the student must possess the initiative to discover and take advantage of these opportunities. Similarly, the school could forever emphasize on creating business leaders for the future, but you can only gain these skills by joining and leading various organizations and not through mere rote learning.

I have also received some requests to share about the unsatisfactory aspects / potential improvements for the NUS Business School.
I will be hard-pressed to share with you about the unsatisfactory aspects of our Business School. If you had asked me this same question before I chose NUS Business School, I would have readily stated oft-mentioned concerns such as:

‘Employees prefer SMU, we are introverted’ – My experience conversing with managers of some blue-chip companies in Singapore tells me that your future career success depends more on how you planned your career path and took advantage of the opportunities in university, rather than which university you come from. And I don’t think we are introverted, from my experience in classes where class participation marks can be significant. But although it can be competitive, I tend to see constructive answers rather than gibberish replies.

‘Much harder to maintain or pursue a double degree’ – I personally attest to this fact though. It is very competitive in the business school. But I knew what I wanted before I started school, hence I made sure I put in extra effort and sacrifices into attaining it.

‘Extremely competitive honors systems’ – Seniors have lamented to me that few ‘2-3%’ attain the holy grail of first-class honors, and second-upper is no less easier too. They compared this with UK where around 11% and 45% get the respective degrees. Personally, I have come to realize the value of a stringent honors system. I also know seniors who have graduated with first-class honors (so its possible!), and seniors who have graduated second-upper, but attain equal success in life due to their stellar leadership positions in various co-curricular activities.

‘Lack of focus of curriculum’ – In my honest opinion, few undergraduate degree curriculums will give you an in-depth knowledge for your future job. In the words of my current supervisor: “The things you learn here… you will never learn in school.” The school is only able to provide you with a reasonably specific curriculum – your future employees do not expect you to be an expert in the field because a lot of knowledge and information is company-specific or acquired through working experience. One possible way to perhaps address this issue would be to apply for internships in that particular field / read up on books (and I don’t mean textbooks!)

‘Old’ – You will only need to come and visit our brand new Mochtar Riady building to change your mindset immediately.

‘Lack of support from school’ – Please see my above replies

‘Over academic, irrelevant’ – Please see my above replies, I have stated that it is actually a healthy balance with a gradual progression to heavier emphasis on projects

‘Lack of reputable overseas exchange universities’ – You may be surprised to note that we have many reputable exchange universities. In fact, we also do go to many universities that the other local universities go to as well, and the students from the three local universities often go out together. More importantly, by virtue of our critical mass, we are able to provide more exchange opportunities for the students.

‘Horrible food’ – Culinary tastes is a very subjective issue, and I must profess that I do not frequent our Business canteen often. But there are a variety of options only a walk or a bus stop away! I often go to the FASS or Engineering canteen with my friends since I get easily bored with food.

I hoped I have adequately shared my first-year experience with you guys, and hopefully, it will give you a good idea of the opportunities and skills you will get, should you choose the NUS Business School.
At the risk of sounding bias or over patriotic, I can assure you that I have no intentions to do so (nor do I have any incentive as well). Sure, there are minor grouses here and there or potential improvements for the school, but then again, I would never choose a university which rests on its laurels and not actively upgrade and revamp itself in this dynamic business world.
What I will promise is that, as long as you have a good idea of what you want to achieve in your life and take the initiative to make use of the abundance of opportunities available so as to work towards your goal, you will never regret your decision just like I have never regretted mine.

Please feel free to PM me / post here if you have further queries, and I will do my best to answer them!

musicrox
06-03-2010, 11:51 AM
Tbh, most of the ppl that I have seen complaining abt the immense workload in smu are those that take double degree. DDP itself in any of the 3 unis is stressful, a large number of ppl in ntu who take acc+biz tend to drop it after the 1st year bcos the workload is too much(sounds familiar?).

I even had a fren who took acc+biz in ntu during the 1st sem, felt she really couldnt take it, and decided to be happier by moving to study at university of melbourne.

Those that I know in SMU taking a single degree are finding it pretty enjoyable in their first year, be it biz or acc, due to the fact that many of the modules are general if not basic biz stuff. All of them have 3 ccas and are still able to cope, so im pretty sure if ppl take single degree with 2 ccas in their first year, it isnt that hard to find leisure time.

It may be different in the 2nd year, but isnt it the same for NTU and NUS as well? Whereby ppl may no longer get priority to stay in halls, start specialising and buckling down on their studies?

FYI: I chose ntu acc, but I have a hunch it might be a choice I will sorely regret for not having the courage to step out of my comfort zone and challenging myself.

slayercsa
06-03-2010, 12:06 PM
woah marcus, that's a long list about NUS. A pity that it came abit too late.

Any negatives to say about NUS ?

marcus
06-03-2010, 12:14 PM
woah marcus, that's a long list about NUS. A pity that it came abit too late.

Any negatives to say about NUS ?

I personally do not have any significant negatives to say about NUS Business School, but then again, I have to stress that it is my personal opinion and others may differ.

Why not you do some research on the forums and state your concerns here? And I will share my thoughts (as well as my peers opinions) on them?

naturality05
06-05-2010, 08:54 PM
Hi everyone.
I've just been offered a place in SMU Business.
But now i'm rather... confused about whether i should accept this (over NTU comm studies- i know very different courses). I'm looking to major in corporate communications.

So i have to ask everyone here, does the business course require you to do very very vigorous math like H2 Math? because my math isnt exactly strong since forever...
And is the workload in SMU Business really that heavy as compared to the other two universities? I'm just worried i cannot handle it.

thanks in advance!

HappyGoLucky
06-05-2010, 11:40 PM
1) Recognition - NUS is a renowned top-notch university, ranked 3rd in Asia in the recently announced QS AUR rankings. This facilitates the pursuit of both future education opportunities and employment prospects, especially in foreign countries.

5) Internships - The career service office in our school has been actively sourcing for internships for the students.

6) Job opportunities - The statistics speak for themselves. We have the highest % of graduates who find a permanent job.

I think this is the 3 most important points in choosing NUS over NTU/SMU. The school's brand name is especially important if you are pursuing a business degree and I have seen first hand the opportunities offered by NUS career services as compared to NTU career services and I must say, NUS has a much better network (possibly because of its alumni).

marcus
06-06-2010, 07:24 PM
Hi everyone.
I've just been offered a place in SMU Business.
But now i'm rather... confused about whether i should accept this (over NTU comm studies- i know very different courses). I'm looking to major in corporate communications.

So i have to ask everyone here, does the business course require you to do very very vigorous math like H2 Math? because my math isnt exactly strong since forever...
And is the workload in SMU Business really that heavy as compared to the other two universities? I'm just worried i cannot handle it.

thanks in advance!

as far as i noe, all business degrees do not require in depth knowledge of maths. even for accounting, the maths is pretty basic. but u have to decide what is ur aim or passion though

slayercsa
06-07-2010, 10:51 AM
but does all business requires a good command of english?

Or just being able to write/communicate in english is sufficient?

Haecceity
06-07-2010, 11:37 AM
but does all business requires a good command of english?

Or just being able to write/communicate in english is sufficient?
For one thing, having a good command of English would prevent misunderstandings from happening if you're communicating in English. Also, if you're studying in a local uni, you'll be examined in English, which means that you should be able to write well enough to pass the exam. I don't think your English needs to be REALLY REALLY good - I know a few business students who don't have fantastic command of English, but manage to get by.

HappyGoLucky
06-07-2010, 01:24 PM
I know a few business students who don't have fantastic command of English, but manage to get by.

Especially true if you major in quant areas like actuarial science or accountancy...

slayercsa
09-25-2010, 10:43 PM
Hi.

Does finance students deal alot with statistics?

Asking cause I am intending to find some courses to take during NS.

blittzz
10-19-2010, 03:36 AM
First of all, is NUS, NTU, SMU considered 1st tier Business Schools in the world?

NUS and NTU probably yes. SMU? Not a chance in the international scene.

Why do NUS and NTU or even SMU need such accreditations? Because they are NOT European or American schools! You see, what we have here is potentially what you can call a "protectionist" policy in a different light. Would Singapore recognise just any Business School from Malaysia? Does Malaysia even recognise NUS and NTU?

The accreditation is not necessary for American and European top tier schools, because it is in their own territory! Schools in other countries need these to ensure that their graduates can get employment in these protectionist regions. Especially when Europeans and Americans hardly understand education outside their very narrow definitions.

So the accreditations are VERY important for non-European and American schools.

NUS and NTU both are acrreditated is what we know. SMU, is just out of the league.

Woots SMU Biz school is going to get its AACSB and EQUIS Accreditation soon (http://www.business.smu.edu.sg/about_school/LKCSB%20e-newsletter%20%281st%20issue%29.pdf). Looks like it will be finally within league huh.:cool:

pnrcewpuyqrvf
10-19-2010, 11:17 AM
Woots SMU Biz school is going to get its AACSB and EQUIS Accreditation soon (http://www.business.smu.edu.sg/about_school/LKCSB%20e-newsletter%20%281st%20issue%29.pdf). Looks like it will be finally within league huh.:cool:

Seriously... outside of Singapore & SEA, SMU is Southern Methodist University (US) not Singapore Management University (SG).

slayercsa
02-05-2011, 11:03 PM
Hope to seek advices from the current students in NBS and SMU

Currently pondering if I should re-apply for NTU as I already got a place in SMU.

Pros of NTU:
3 years direct honours
Cheaper tuition fees ( Save up to 15k )
Opportunity cost around 30k and 1 year working experience
Reputable

Cons of NTU:
Streaming criterias need to be fulfilled in order to get desire major
Long travelling time

Pros of SMU:
Accessible
Almost 100% chance to get desired major and double major

Cons of SMU:
Expensive fees and misc. fees


Maybe I would like to ask the students of respective shcool how's their curriculum like? I know SMU is seminar style with emphasis of class participation, but I need more feedback on NTU.

Thank you.

sonrocker
02-06-2011, 12:08 PM
Hope to seek advices from the current students in NBS and SMU

Currently pondering if I should re-apply for NTU as I already got a place in SMU.

Pros of NTU:
3 years direct honours
Cheaper tuition fees ( Save up to 15k )
Opportunity cost around 30k and 1 year working experience
Reputable

Cons of NTU:
Streaming criterias need to be fulfilled in order to get desire major
Long travelling time

Pros of SMU:
Accessible
Almost 100% chance to get desired major and double major

Cons of SMU:
Expensive fees and misc. fees


Maybe I would like to ask the students of respective shcool how's their curriculum like? I know SMU is seminar style with emphasis of class participation, but I need more feedback on NTU.

Thank you.

First of all, you should reapply. Having options is always a good thing.
I'm from NTU and this is my perspectives:

NBS:
+Great level of support from profs and seniors BUT you have to build the network yourself in order to climb to the top.
+Shorter duration of the course is uniquely advantageous. Getting into the market earlier than your peers could make a difference.
+Other points in terms of cheaper tuition fees and reputation.
+NTU Biz has an option of taking Accountancy as the second specification if you make the cut ( Application in year 2 )
-It's inconvenient to make a journey to NTU everyday if you stay quite a distance away. But if you get a place in hall, it's a non-issue. A few of my friends actually stay in Pasir Ris. I admire these people. Haha.
Other points to note:
.NBS also has seminar style and class participation is also a component, however, I will be lying if I say it's heavily emphasized.
.Streaming depends on your GPA and individual score of certain modules. What specification(s) are you interested in?

SMU:
+Extremely robust career service. I have seen my SMU counterparts landing offers that other schools can't lay their hands on. I remember UBS sent to NTU a list of offers and some of the top jobs are already reserved to SMU students.
+The school environment in SMU is generally competitive. I think I would perform better if I see rich executives on my way to school everyday. This is strictly personal. Haha.
+Saturday seems like another school day in SMU. You will be swamped with projects. This is not to say you won't in NTU but it's possible for NBS students to arrange their timetable such that they have one weekday off.
+SMU Biz has specific tracks ( Quant Finance, Investment Banking, etc ) and they provide a good foundation if you plan to go into such field.
-It burns a hole in your pocket just paying the school fees.
-The marketing effort of saying SMU is this, that etc is not exactly the truth. It boils down to YOU as a person.

so....RE-APPLY! Haha.

v3ng3anc3z
02-06-2011, 01:48 PM
First of all, you should reapply. Having options is always a good thing.
I'm from NTU and this is my perspectives:

NBS:
+Great level of support from profs and seniors BUT you have to build the network yourself in order to climb to the top.
+Shorter duration of the course is uniquely advantageous. Getting into the market earlier than your peers could make a difference.
+Other points in terms of cheaper tuition fees and reputation.
+NTU Biz has an option of taking Accountancy as the second specification if you make the cut ( Application in year 2 )
-It's inconvenient to make a journey to NTU everyday if you stay quite a distance away. But if you get a place in hall, it's a non-issue. A few of my friends actually stay in Pasir Ris. I admire these people. Haha.
Other points to note:
.NBS also has seminar style and class participation is also a component, however, I will be lying if I say it's heavily emphasized.
.Streaming depends on your GPA and individual score of certain modules. What specification(s) are you interested in?

SMU:
+Extremely robust career service. I have seen my SMU counterparts landing offers that other schools can't lay their hands on. I remember UBS sent to NTU a list of offers and some of the top jobs are already reserved to SMU students.
+The school environment in SMU is generally competitive. I think I would perform better if I see rich executives on my way to school everyday. This is strictly personal. Haha.
+Saturday seems like another school day in SMU. You will be swamped with projects. This is not to say you won't in NTU but it's possible for NBS students to arrange their timetable such that they have one weekday off.
+SMU Biz has specific tracks ( Quant Finance, Investment Banking, etc ) and they provide a good foundation if you plan to go into such field.
-It burns a hole in your pocket just paying the school fees.
-The marketing effort of saying SMU is this, that etc is not exactly the truth. It boils down to YOU as a person.

so....RE-APPLY! Haha.

Any personal insights regarding NUS? :D

sonrocker
02-06-2011, 03:02 PM
I am not particularly in touch with NUS Biz.

slayercsa
02-06-2011, 09:43 PM
First of all, you should reapply. Having options is always a good thing.
I'm from NTU and this is my perspectives:

NBS:
+Great level of support from profs and seniors BUT you have to build the network yourself in order to climb to the top.
+Shorter duration of the course is uniquely advantageous. Getting into the market earlier than your peers could make a difference.
+Other points in terms of cheaper tuition fees and reputation.
+NTU Biz has an option of taking Accountancy as the second specification if you make the cut ( Application in year 2 )
-It's inconvenient to make a journey to NTU everyday if you stay quite a distance away. But if you get a place in hall, it's a non-issue. A few of my friends actually stay in Pasir Ris. I admire these people. Haha.
Other points to note:
.NBS also has seminar style and class participation is also a component, however, I will be lying if I say it's heavily emphasized.
.Streaming depends on your GPA and individual score of certain modules. What specification(s) are you interested in?

SMU:
+Extremely robust career service. I have seen my SMU counterparts landing offers that other schools can't lay their hands on. I remember UBS sent to NTU a list of offers and some of the top jobs are already reserved to SMU students.
+The school environment in SMU is generally competitive. I think I would perform better if I see rich executives on my way to school everyday. This is strictly personal. Haha.
+Saturday seems like another school day in SMU. You will be swamped with projects. This is not to say you won't in NTU but it's possible for NBS students to arrange their timetable such that they have one weekday off.
+SMU Biz has specific tracks ( Quant Finance, Investment Banking, etc ) and they provide a good foundation if you plan to go into such field.
-It burns a hole in your pocket just paying the school fees.
-The marketing effort of saying SMU is this, that etc is not exactly the truth. It boils down to YOU as a person.

so....RE-APPLY! Haha.

I'm interested in Finance major. One pro of NTU is it is a CFA partner. Will help me if I wan to be a financial analyst next time.

sonrocker
02-06-2011, 11:10 PM
I'm interested in Finance major. One pro of NTU is it is a CFA partner. Will help me if I wan to be a financial analyst next time.

Yes NTU is a CFA partner. BUT passing the CFA exams depends on you as a candidate. I don't see the connection actually.

Being a Banking & Finance major is not difficult. If you don't screw up your 1st year, I do not see a problem.

seeweiren
02-19-2011, 01:54 AM
I'm interested in Finance major. One pro of NTU is it is a CFA partner. Will help me if I wan to be a financial analyst next time.


If you are so determined to be a financial analyst, I will suggest you to go look up the course outline for each specific module and look out for who's the instructor. That will help you for your school selection. CFA partner doesnt mean that you degree will transform you cert to a CFA equivalent. You still have to take the paper in any case.

And trust me the real world case scenario will never be the same as what you are taught, where academics will tell you everything under an arbitrage-free and market efficient condition.

slayercsa
03-06-2011, 09:39 PM
Actually I got friends telling me that SMU B&F is better than NTU's and they are from NTU.

Anyone from NTU with similar sentiments..?

PacMan
03-07-2011, 10:05 AM
I think NUS is better than NTU, but I don't think SMU is better than NTU.

Just personal opinion lar...

seeweiren
03-07-2011, 01:02 PM
Actually I got friends telling me that SMU B&F is better than NTU's and they are from NTU.

Anyone from NTU with similar sentiments..?

B&F is so broad! Look out for what sort of division you are interested in. There are different tracks offered by NTU and SMU, i.e. Investment Banking, International Trading etc. If you like risk management aspect of Finance,NTU and SMU offer Actuarial Science, while NUS doesn't. Also, NUS and SMU offer Quantitative Finance at Undergraduate Level, just that NUS offer that in the School of Science in Applied Mathematics.
From what i know, NUS finance is just a general major.

slayercsa
03-07-2011, 10:27 PM
B&F is so broad! Look out for what sort of division you are interested in. There are different tracks offered by NTU and SMU, i.e. Investment Banking, International Trading etc. If you like risk management aspect of Finance,NTU and SMU offer Actuarial Science, while NUS doesn't. Also, NUS and SMU offer Quantitative Finance at Undergraduate Level, just that NUS offer that in the School of Science in Applied Mathematics.
From what i know, NUS finance is just a general major.

Haha ye. I just saw BBM guidebook..Mind teling me what you learn from Quantitative finance? Cause it sounds pretty awesome. :p

seeweiren
03-08-2011, 04:24 AM
http://www.business.smu.edu.sg/disciplines/quantitative_finance/

marcus
03-11-2011, 04:34 AM
Dear all,

NUS will be having its open house from 12-13 March 2011 (Sat - Sun).

The NUS Business School will be represented by a huge contingent of passionate undergraduates (we only get paid a nominal fee).

If you are unsure of whether NUS, or NUS Business School is for you, this is a good opportunity to ask seniors about their experiences, as this will be the best way for you to make an informed choice.

I will be there as well (Saturday 9am-1pm), so you can PM me if you want to discuss more about making your choice.

Alternatively, you can PM me to discuss it via the message system as well!

Regards,
Marcus

cheng0112
03-25-2011, 03:14 PM
I think NUS is better than NTU, but I don't think SMU is better than NTU.

Just personal opinion lar...

i beg to differ.
was from nus.
4 years of chap-pa-lang, ntu completed in 3 years.
big 4 firm , credit suisse and goldman-sach always target and go to ntu to "poach" those students but for my school, seldom. really sad about it.

and my NUS accounting lecturers were all graduates of NTU some more. -_-" how ironic. anyway i've graduated from NUS and currently working as a banker but still i always regretted not getting into ntu.

and please.
smu stands no where near ntu/nus. its rife rumor that goes like this.

During a career job fair at NUS :
Partner to banking and finance student: hi, why don't you apply with my firm? (big 4)
Banking n finance student: but i have no experience in accounting!
Partner: don't worry, even what you have learnt is more then half of what smu accounting students learn.


LOL. im serious and im not kidding. many of my lecturers was present when that partner said that. maybe things changed.. and SMU up-ped their standard.. :)

cheng0112
03-25-2011, 03:17 PM
First of all, you should reapply. Having options is always a good thing.
I'm from NTU and this is my perspectives:

NBS:
+Great level of support from profs and seniors BUT you have to build the network yourself in order to climb to the top.
+Shorter duration of the course is uniquely advantageous. Getting into the market earlier than your peers could make a difference.
+Other points in terms of cheaper tuition fees and reputation.
+NTU Biz has an option of taking Accountancy as the second specification if you make the cut ( Application in year 2 )
-It's inconvenient to make a journey to NTU everyday if you stay quite a distance away. But if you get a place in hall, it's a non-issue. A few of my friends actually stay in Pasir Ris. I admire these people. Haha.
Other points to note:
.NBS also has seminar style and class participation is also a component, however, I will be lying if I say it's heavily emphasized.
.Streaming depends on your GPA and individual score of certain modules. What specification(s) are you interested in?

SMU:
+Extremely robust career service. I have seen my SMU counterparts landing offers that other schools can't lay their hands on. I remember UBS sent to NTU a list of offers and some of the top jobs are already reserved to SMU students.
+The school environment in SMU is generally competitive. I think I would perform better if I see rich executives on my way to school everyday. This is strictly personal. Haha.
+Saturday seems like another school day in SMU. You will be swamped with projects. This is not to say you won't in NTU but it's possible for NBS students to arrange their timetable such that they have one weekday off.
+SMU Biz has specific tracks ( Quant Finance, Investment Banking, etc ) and they provide a good foundation if you plan to go into such field.
-It burns a hole in your pocket just paying the school fees.
-The marketing effort of saying SMU is this, that etc is not exactly the truth. It boils down to YOU as a person.

so....RE-APPLY! Haha.

re-apply.
if you can get to a better school, why not?

cheng0112
03-25-2011, 03:19 PM
I think this is the 3 most important points in choosing NUS over NTU/SMU. The school's brand name is especially important if you are pursuing a business degree and I have seen first hand the opportunities offered by NUS career services as compared to NTU career services and I must say, NUS has a much better network (possibly because of its alumni).

you're wrong.
NUS business school is not ranked.
however NTU's is.

just google it and you will see.
in any case, rankings are arbitrary.
you have to consider the standard of education in each different schools.

i feel the fight only boils down to NTU and NUS. SMU is too new a school as compared to both NTU and nus which has 50 years of established experience.

to me i think, ntu first, cannot then nus also can.

cheng0112
03-25-2011, 03:26 PM
i would like to dispute this website:

http://www.transitioning.org/2010/04/07/graduate-employment-survey-2009-published-2010-salary-sg/

as utter rubbish.

my cousin who is in nbs has already informed me that recently KPMG has raised its basic pay for auditors from 2.6k (lousy) to 3.1k (respectable) all the other big 4 is expected to follow suit come this fiscal year.

banking in commercial banks like JPMORGAN, credit suisse, is slated at 3.7K.

for local banks like dbs etc i not so sure. i'm not working there.


90% of nbs graduates get jobs at start of year 3 (after year 2 internship)

NUS has an advantage cos it can do 2 internship as it is a 4 yr course.

NUS:
Big 4 firm offer same incentives to NUS. exactly the same incentives.

however, because nus is 4 years, that equates to 3.1k*12=36000+++ (not inclusive bonus) of opportunity cost lost to a NUS student going in in AY2011/2012 . 36000+another 8000(school fees)=44,000$ real monies lost for a nus in total factoring in sch fees.

think about it. =) but NUS location is way better then NTU. unless you live in JOOKOON ... i think NUS location is a good consideration focal point.

seeweiren
03-26-2011, 12:45 AM
A breakdown of the employment statistics.

A Survey captured from MOE website.

For those who still have high doubt about SMU, look at the performance of their graduates despite being existent for 10 years.

I am not saying that SMU should be the best, but each business school has their own strength. If you are someone who just want a good job, it doesnt matter which local business school you come from, as they are equally good.

But to me, I think SMU prep the undergraduates well to the workforce, which can be reflected by their graduate employment rate and a higher average pay. NUS and NTU are very strong in their graduate programs, I can confidently say they are on par with many of the top US schools. Asia Business School are getting more recognition, in fact they should since US and Europe are probably facing a shrinking economy...

blittzz
03-27-2011, 12:48 AM
I think if one decides to work in Singapore, it doesnt really matter which business school you go to as all 3 schools (NUS, NTU and SMU) are equally recognised here.

What matters the most is the grades you achieved when you graduate from the programme (1st Class Hons and Summa Cum Laudes achievers are usually sought after the most), the activities you've engaged in to value-add to your portfolio in order to distinguish yourself from the other job seekers (eg. winner of business case competitions), the attitude and enthusiasm you exude when you present yourself at the interview and thereafter at work and last but not least, the ability to adapt to new environments quickly and to apply the relevant soft skills (eg. office diplomacy, negotiation and leadership) as well as hard knowledge as and when needed.

With excellent grades, adequate and relevant work experience, combined with glowing appraisals from your employers and professors, one can even pursue an MBA from an top B-School such as London School of Business, Harvard Business School, University of Chicago Booth School of Business, Columbia Business School..etc.

Once you've obtained your MBA from the more internationally-recognised top B-school, alot more doors are opened and the world is your stage. From then on you could start the climb up the corporate ladder, perhaps in a firm with an MBA as a prerequisite of entry but with a bigger pay package, better upward mobility and a more pronounced global exposure that will really stretch your abilities and skills and widen your horizons.

From then on, nobody would ever question your choice of college for your bachelor degree.

Because it has ceased to matter. :p

blittzz
03-27-2011, 01:45 PM
By the way do take a look at these advertisements..

SMU School of Law (http://www.smu.edu.sg/news_room/smu_in_the_news/2011/sources/ST_20110307_1.pdf)

SMU Lee Kong Chian School Of Business (http://www.smu.edu.sg/news_room/smu_in_the_news/2011/sources/TODAY_20110323_1.pdf)

SMU School of Accountancy (http://www.smu.edu.sg/news_room/smu_in_the_news/2011/sources/ST_20110320_2.pdf)

SMU School of Economics (http://www.smu.edu.sg/news_room/smu_in_the_news/2011/sources/TODAY_20110314_1.pdf)

SMU School of Social Sciences (http://www.smu.edu.sg/news_room/smu_in_the_news/2011/sources/ST_20110325_2.pdf)

SMU School of Information Systems (http://www.smu.edu.sg/news_room/smu_in_the_news/2011/sources/ST_20110313_2.pdf)

Holistic Education (http://www.smu.edu.sg/news_room/smu_in_the_news/2011/sources/ST_20110316_6.pdf)

I guess if SMU being one of the new kids on the block in the education landscape can produce people who are hired by respectable local and international firms, NUS and NTU graduates would definitely have no problem in their employment.

It is really about the individual graduate's attitude and aptitude.

Groupon
03-27-2011, 07:32 PM
you're wrong.
NUS business school is not ranked.
however NTU's is.

many employers do NOT know the business school rankings but follow the THE or ARWU rankings instead. that's where NUS does better than NTU.

Groupon
03-27-2011, 07:35 PM
and my NUS accounting lecturers were all graduates of NTU some more. -_-" how ironic.

makes sense right? NUS just started their accounting degree so how can there be lecturers who are NUS grads? :confused:

slayercsa
04-03-2011, 05:38 PM
Btw I just discover this.

SMU has just been accredited with AACSB.

souce: https://www.aacsb.net/eweb/DynamicPage.aspx?Site=AACSB&WebKey=00E50DA9-8BB0-4A32-B7F7-0A92E98DF5C6

So does this mean that a SMU degree can be use to work overseas, albeit not well known?

blittzz
04-03-2011, 08:05 PM
Btw I just discover this.

SMU has just been accredited with AACSB.

souce: https://www.aacsb.net/eweb/DynamicPa...7-0A92E98DF5C6

So does this mean that a SMU degree can be use to work overseas, albeit not well known?

I'm not surprised.

Howard Thomas, the dean of SMU Business school, was the chairman of AACSB International.

It is inevitable that SMU will be accreditated.

I think the accreditation does lend international recognition to SMU. At least international employers who havent heard of SMU or even Singapore as a country for the matter, can check against the AACSB website and verify the qualifications.

jayax
05-07-2011, 10:03 AM
I've been following this thread for a couple months now. As a final yr student, perhaps i can help to quell some common misconceptions and contribute my views, especially with regards to employment opportunities etc. Hope this helps in your decision making.

FAQ (2011)

Q1. What value does an honours degree in business hold for me?

Before making any judgement calls, always ask yourself what an honours degree in business can do for you, and why you would want to pursue it in the first place.

Employment-wise, most structured graduate programs offered by the major foreign banks (RBS, BoA/Merril, DB, CS, UBS etc) and the more prestigious marketing/consultancy firms require at least a second-upper honours from their applicants. For the benefit of those of those who haven’t a foggiest what a structured program is, it’s a fast(er) track management training program for fresh graduates that rotates you around the company/bank, and usually comes with higher pay and promotion opportunities, albeit always subject to work performance of course. These are by and large the people whom a company/bank targets to fill future leadership positions. An example can be found here: http://www2.goldmansachs.com/careers/our-firm/divisions/operations/positions/new-analyst.html

Having said that, an honours degree is not always strictly necessary for entrance into these programs, as I have personally heard of a few cases where exceptional applicants are offered jobs in their penultimate year in prestigious institutions. These people usually excel academically though, and more importantly, possess exceptional skills and qualities and/or have already distinguished themselves to the institution to the degree that it is understood they would have achieved at least a 2nd upper if they had chosen to complete their honours year. Thus, in this light, reading honours year can be seen to be optional if you view yourself (and employers view you) as part of this category.

If you’re thinking of starting work in the Public sector (eg MAS), then a 2:1 honours is usually a pre-requisite for acceptance.

Note that 2:1 honours usually comprises, on average, about 15% of a matriculating cohort in NUS business, while 1:1 honours usually makes up a mere 4-5%.

If you find yourself among the 2:2 honours graduating cohort, there is no need to be terribly worried either since the upper-mid-range institutions hire from this range as well for their structured programs. The majority of honours graduates from all 3 universities’ business faculties fall within this category.

If you are a third class honours holder, then (from what I’ve heard) you would have been better off not doing an honours degree at all as it does not reflect very well on you academically. The information in the next paragraph would better apply to you.

If you graduate without an honours degree, depending on your CAP, it is still very possible to find good employment in a very wide range of jobs, from HR/management to logistics etc in almost every industry. A business degree is ultimately a general degree, and as such can be used for employment almost everywhere.

At the end of the day, while academics do play a somewhat important part in landing a good first job, do keep in mind that ultimately it is your work ethic, personality, skill and performance that will set you apart from your peers, and these are probably better correlation factors for predicting long-term career success than pure academic results alone. Having said that, take note that there are many people who do well academically who possess the above traits as well.

Q2. Reading Honours at NUS is contingent on grades (CAP > 3.5) while NTU offers a direct honours system. Since NUS is a 4-year course and NTU’s is 3 years, why would anyone choose NUS over the latter?

One major distinguishing factor would the brand name. Having participated in the student exchange program and studied in a foreign university/ lived in a foreign land for the better part of a year, I am of the opinion that the NUS brand does pull more weight internationally, among academics, employers, and the collective international consciousness, and is more well-known/visible than the other 2 local unis. I’m saying this as a matter of fact, and am not implying that NUS is intrinsically ‘better’ than SMU/NTU.

This advantage may be simply be due to the fact that NUS has been around for a longer time than the other two unis, thus giving it a significant first-mover advantage. To better illustrate this logic, consider how NUS Law and SMU Law measure against each other when the latter has not had a very long time to build up its brand or reputation. In addition, NUS was (and is) a research university, and thus has had a good 30-year or so lead in which to flood international mainstream research journals with articles published by its academics, thus contributing to better international brand awareness.

Having said that, local employers do not discriminate much between the three local unis as all three are known locally for churning out good quality graduates. However, if part of your aspirations (or possible future career routes) include working overseas or being hired by foreign employers, the brand name advantage alone may help in securing that first interview (after which your interview skills etc would come into play). Lastly, it is probable that as the other two universities churn out more and more graduates who work overseas, over time, brand recognition for NTU/SMU may reach the point of equivalency, but I think I can safely say that that is not yet the case as of this point in time.

Another factor would be furthering your studies on a graduate level. Most quality American MBA programs (NYU Stern, Uni Penn Wharton etc) prefer (if not outright require) a 4-year undergraduate program in their applicants ( http://www.mbaonlineprograms.net/mba-news-feed/eligibility-requirements-for-international-mba-students.html ) so if you’re planning on furthering your studies at a quality MBA program, a 3-year direct honours degree may not be the best choice. This is an especially relevant factor given the increasing requirements for an MBA to be promoted into top management positions in many institutions. For many, this may be the most important reason for choosing a 4-year program over a 3-year one, since it does have a very real and direct impact on your access to quality post-graduate education, and by extension, your future career trajectory.

After taking into consideration the added value of a good MBA, it may actually more than make up for the one-year's pay advantage that NTU grads enjoy in their 1st yr, especially since pay raises tend to be non-linear and scale better at senior managerial positions, vis junior positions. For eg, a 5% annual increase when at 10,000/month translates to a larger absolute amount than a 5% increase when you're earning 2800/m, and the real percentage increase when you're senior management tends to be higher as well due to larger accumulated bonuses (which are calculated on a monthly pay basis, eg 5 month's bonus etc). If you were to do a simple time value calculation with a modest discount (reinvestment) rate of 4% p.a, you will find that the break even point tends to be around just under ~8-9 years after you start working, after which you would be increasingly better off. I'm sorry if i'm getting too technical here, but i'm trying to use calculation to show how a short-term 1 year salary lead may not necessarily translate to making you better off in the long run.

Lastly, from personal experience, an accelerated undergraduate program (ie, 3 years) may not always be in your best interests if you’re intending to major in a technical specialisation such as finance.
The NUS curriculum requires 6 different modules/topics in finance that give you good breadth and depth / good working knowledge of almost every field of finance, enabling you to better experience and decide which field you enjoy the most and would want to work for in the future. I would say that this is one of the strengths of the NUS curriculum, as (speaking from first-hand experience) content learned in academic finance is usually also content that can be applied on-the-job, and which employers appreciate. Accelerating this content into a 3-year course may be suitable for some people, but overall I am of the opinion that for the average person it is well worth tackling the topic at a manageable pace in order to achieve both breadth and depth, which are ultimately value-added elements.

Q3. NTU published a ranking that ranks it higher than NUS, does that mean it is better?

As with all rankings, it is good to keep some perspective, such as which organisation does the ranking etc. Both NUS/NTU business schools tend to publish rankings that place them above each other on that particular ranking scale by that particular ranking organisation, and since it is not feasible nor accurate to count the number of superior rankings each school has achieved by numerous organisations (NUS has more anyway due to its MBA program) as a measure of the school’s quality, this point may not be a very good way to compare them. For an example of what I mean, click on the ranking links below:

http://rankings.ft.com/businessschoolrankings/national-university-of-singapore
http://www.nbs.ntu.edu.sg/Corporate/Pages/accreditation.aspx

Conclusion

I’ve tried to be as fair and objective as I can in this post, and have prefaced (or suffixed) which parts are my personal opinion and which parts are regarded as fact. I hope that this helps future applicants in their decision making process, and finally lays to rest the perennial 3-year direct honours vs 4-year optional honours quandary.

curiosojusto
05-13-2011, 11:23 PM
help me.

ive been offered ddp for business and accountancy for both SMU/NTU.

SMU is offering me their SMU Scholars Programme but im more inclined towards NTU because of their hall life and..I think I'd have it easier in NTU. NTU's not offering me any scholarships but one of the professors at NBS told me he'd be helping me appeal to dean of financial aid for a scholarship.

I am very outspoken, so I think no matter where I go it'd be the same. It wouldnt really matter. I have no qualms about doing project work or studying on my own either.

guys, offer me advice? Both DDPs would take 4 years. Need your advice badly. please comment!

blittzz
05-14-2011, 10:43 AM
Listen to your heart. It has spoken and I think you have already decided which school you want to go to.

Just go for it !

Anyway rest assured that no matter which school you go to, ultimately it is your own learning and work capabilities as well as the grade you have graduated with that will determine your place in the corporate world.

jerms
05-23-2011, 07:34 PM
Hello,

I like to seek help and opinions from any seniors or alumni about nus bba (acc) or nus bba

1. Generally, How is life being a nus bba student? (eg. hall life, the modules schedules, teaching style)

2. Does nus bba (acc) have the same flexibility as ntu to allow students to be offered a 2nd spec? (eg. finance or marketing) Or do i need to bid them?

3. How well does the career services in nus prepare students to get internships? (of course, you need to take initiative to impress your interviewers so skip this part)

4. Can we choose when to do the modules to balance our schedule? cos ntu allows that to happen. so im wondering nus does allows too.

I don't want a brief answer so please elaborate and answer honestly. i'm sure many others out there are still in a dilemma to consider which uni to go to. so thanks a lot!

sianjp
05-27-2011, 07:34 AM
Hi, i too need advice with regards to choosing bet smu bbm and ntu bba. The factors I am considering are as follows:
curriculum and possibility of taking a second major/dd
for ntu : its, 3 yrs, direct honors, has more accreditations, and i prefer the curriculum as les emphasisis placed on projects as compared to smu (i'm an introvert) . however, i stay in the east and hv no idea abt hotel life, and i think only selected people(top 20%?) are allowed to do double majors. (seniors/alumni- how tough is it, really, to compete/attain the requirements needed for me to qualify for the double major)
for smu,
its much nearer to my house, it alo seems easier to get a double major (is like you just have to bid for the second major's modules right?). a mentioned above, i'm an introvert so i believe tt smu would be a good training ground for me to be more outspoken and hv better presentation skills. In addition, there may be a chance that i may qualify for a double d by the second year if i work really hard.
however, can anyone share how difficult/ realistic is it for me to be able to attain the required gpa to qualify for the double d. in addition, honors are given out based on gpa. how hard is it to get the required gpa for a 1st class hons? (the talks make it look as though good honors in smu are easy to get- but is that true in reality?) in addition, the high emphasis on PW means tt i may lose out to others who are better in PW as compared to individual exams. i fear this may ultimatelty affect what i graduate with or even close my chances of qualifying for a double d.
considering how i would really like to graduate with something more than just a single major degree, which do people think I should go for?
thanks very much(in advance) for the advice :)

slayercsa
05-28-2011, 10:35 PM
Hi, i too need advice with regards to choosing bet smu bbm and ntu bba. The factors I am considering are as follows:
curriculum and possibility of taking a second major/dd
for ntu : its, 3 yrs, direct honors, has more accreditations, and i prefer the curriculum as les emphasisis placed on projects as compared to smu (i'm an introvert) . however, i stay in the east and hv no idea abt hotel life, and i think only selected people(top 20%?) are allowed to do double majors. (seniors/alumni- how tough is it, really, to compete/attain the requirements needed for me to qualify for the double major)
for smu,
its much nearer to my house, it alo seems easier to get a double major (is like you just have to bid for the second major's modules right?). a mentioned above, i'm an introvert so i believe tt smu would be a good training ground for me to be more outspoken and hv better presentation skills. In addition, there may be a chance that i may qualify for a double d by the second year if i work really hard.
however, can anyone share how difficult/ realistic is it for me to be able to attain the required gpa to qualify for the double d. in addition, honors are given out based on gpa. how hard is it to get the required gpa for a 1st class hons? (the talks make it look as though good honors in smu are easy to get- but is that true in reality?) in addition, the high emphasis on PW means tt i may lose out to others who are better in PW as compared to individual exams. i fear this may ultimatelty affect what i graduate with or even close my chances of qualifying for a double d.
considering how i would really like to graduate with something more than just a single major degree, which do people think I should go for?
thanks very much(in advance) for the advice :)

Hi. I am in a similar situation as you. Stay in the east, double major. I went with SMU as my final choice.

sianjp
05-29-2011, 02:01 PM
Hi. I am in a similar situation as you. Stay in the east, double major. I went with SMU as my final choice.

hey, tts good to know :)
may i know the majors you studied? was it easy for you to get the majors you wanted (as in the bidding process/gpa required - confused about tt too)? majors are declared in the second year?

by the way, is it possible to further study (like get a masters in business-related/finance-related courses) if i study BBM now?

thanks!

MUDAC
05-29-2011, 04:06 PM
by the way, is it possible to further study (like get a masters in business-related/finance-related courses) if i study BBM now?


yes. in fact most postgrad business/finance courses take in both bbm and non-bbm students. depending on the school they will consider other factors like work experience, GMAT score, testimonials etc

slayercsa
05-29-2011, 06:54 PM
hey, tts good to know :)
may i know the majors you studied? was it easy for you to get the majors you wanted (as in the bidding process/gpa required - confused about tt too)? majors are declared in the second year?

by the way, is it possible to further study (like get a masters in business-related/finance-related courses) if i study BBM now?

thanks!

Hi. I am still in NS, going uni in 2012. I am curious about your question too..the bidding part. But imo, it should be easier than NTU to get your double major.

sianjp
05-30-2011, 07:11 PM
yes. in fact most postgrad business/finance courses take in both bbm and non-bbm students. depending on the school they will consider other factors like work experience, GRE score, testimonials etc

GRE? whats that?
hmmm. i too have the opinion that it is easier to get double majors in SMU. but how about the honors chances- eg getting at least a summa cum laude vs the assured honors in NTU.
ultimately, if i want to have more chances to graduate with something more than a single major degree, would ntu/ smu be the better choice.
plus, will employers have a bias against hiring smu students just because their IGP is lower?

MUDAC
05-30-2011, 09:08 PM
GRE? whats that?

sorry, for business postgrad it should be GMAT, not GRE.

GRE: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graduate_Record_Examinations
GMAT: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graduate_Management_Admission_Test

pokerface
05-30-2011, 11:07 PM
Based on hearsay from friends in SMU, you get to do double majors as long as you hit at least a cumulative GPA of 2 which isn't that hard to do. Its not like NUS/NTU where you need to attain at least above 3.5 in order to declare a second major.

But, like any other major you have chosen, you need to bid for the modules you want.
The competition in biz school may be relatively stiff considering that it is the largest faculty in SMU.

sianjp
05-31-2011, 12:21 AM
Based on hearsay from friends in SMU, you get to do double majors as long as you hit at least a cumulative GPA of 2 which isn't that hard to do. Its not like NUS/NTU where you need to attain at least above 3.5 in order to declare a second major.

But, like any other major you have chosen, you need to bid for the modules you want.
The competition in biz school may be relatively stiff considering that it is the largest faculty in SMU.

erm, so is it like, upon entering smu biz, we can declare the major (in yr 1), and subsequently, bid for the major we want(in yr 1). then in the second year or so, declare the second major based on what modules we have taken in the past few semesters?

slayercsa
06-01-2011, 08:02 AM
GRE? whats that?
hmmm. i too have the opinion that it is easier to get double majors in SMU. but how about the honors chances- eg getting at least a summa cum laude vs the assured honors in NTU.
ultimately, if i want to have more chances to graduate with something more than a single major degree, would ntu/ smu be the better choice.
plus, will employers have a bias against hiring smu students just because their IGP is lower?

NTU does not assured you honors. Direct honours simply meant that if you won't need any criteria to go to honour year. If you did not hit the target for a 3rd class degree, you will most probably get a passing degree.

Based on hearsay from friends in SMU, you get to do double majors as long as you hit at least a cumulative GPA of 2 which isn't that hard to do. Its not like NUS/NTU where you need to attain at least above 3.5 in order to declare a second major.

But, like any other major you have chosen, you need to bid for the modules you want.
The competition in biz school may be relatively stiff considering that it is the largest faculty in SMU.

o....the GPA of 2 is a hearsay. But from what I know, usually the students in their respective school get priority in bidding. Then the 2nd round of bidding is for students from other schools.

sianjp
06-02-2011, 12:09 AM
NTU does not assured you honors. Direct honours simply meant that if you won't need any criteria to go to honour year. If you did not hit the target for a 3rd class degree, you will most probably get a passing degree.


wow. i did not know that--- huge misconception rgding direct honors.
anyway, i finally accepted smu .... hope it goes well

JKOH
11-15-2011, 12:48 AM
Hello everyone, I'm currently a JC student taking my A' levels this year. I've just look through the indicative grade profiles for the 3 unis on their respective accounting and business courses and the 20 pages on this thread. Still, I have quite a few questions and hope you all could help me with :)

1. I'm interested in finance and specifically, both investment banking and wealth management. Quantitative finance looks interesting but I still don't really get the idea of it yet. I understand that NUS major is just finance and not a specific finance track so I was wondering would the other 2 unis be a better choice?

2. (okay this might sound dumb) but whats the fundamental difference between an accounting degree and a BBA or a BBM? If I want to major in finance, and intend to do investment banking/ private banking in the future, what degree would be the most suitable? Because both the degrees seem to allow a major in finance.

teddynuts
11-15-2011, 07:21 AM
2. (okay this might sound dumb) but whats the fundamental difference between an accounting degree and a BBA or a BBM? If I want to major in finance, and intend to do investment banking/ private banking in the future, what degree would be the most suitable? Because both the degrees seem to allow a major in finance.

An accounting degree is a more specialised "business" degree. You need an accounting degree to be a certified accountant. Most accountants work in the Big 4: PWC, Deloitte, Ernst n Young, KPMG. BBA and BBM I am not so sure, but I would say that they are more or less similar with slightly different focuses. Just a tidbit, accounting is usually more competitive than BBA or BBM.

Btw, investment banking and private banking has been notorious for its obscenely high pay and horrible working conditions and hours. But it is important to note that only the high-fliers get to be investment bankers who really reap the big bucks. That forms about 5% of the bank usually. Most of the others stick to a comfortable benefit and pay scheme, but do not reap in windfalls and millions. Regardless of your degree, banks and firms want you to first do well in uni and lead a holistic life and perform well during interview. After which, it is job performance. A very apt phrase used to describe investment and private banking especially is: either you are up or you are out.

JKOH
11-15-2011, 02:32 PM
Thank you! Okay, I think an accounting degree is better as well. From what I read, accounting is a professional degree but not really for BBA/BBM? (i assume BBA and BBM are the same) Furthermore, since more math is involved in accounting, would it be more beneficial if i choose accounting and then work in a bank instead of just taking a BBA/BBM? And would it be possible if I could major in banking and finance while taking up an accounting degree?

Yeah, I've read from the other threads that a finance career is very hectic and all... I'll see how it goes in the future. Thanks anyway! :)

From the rankings so far, NUS seems to be better than NTU. SMU is newer so its inevitable its lower down in the ranking list. However, NBS degree seems to be more specialised than a BBA so I'm really not sure which is more suitable for me. If I would like to venture overseas for work, I would guess a degree from NUS or NTU is better right, given they have better international or regional recognition than SMU. So currently, Im thinking its either NUS or NTU but its really a tough choice. Help me!!

teddynuts
11-15-2011, 02:45 PM
Thank you! Okay, I think an accounting degree is better as well. From what I read, accounting is a professional degree but not really for BBA/BBM? (i assume BBA and BBM are the same) Furthermore, since more math is involved in accounting, would it be more beneficial if i choose accounting and then work in a bank instead of just taking a BBA/BBM? And would it be possible if I could major in banking and finance while taking up an accounting degree?

Yeah, I've read from the other threads that a finance career is very hectic and all... I'll see how it goes in the future. Thanks anyway! :)

From the rankings so far, NUS seems to be better than NTU. SMU is newer so its inevitable its lower down in the ranking list. However, NBS degree seems to be more specialised than a BBA so I'm really not sure which is more suitable for me. If I would like to venture overseas for work, I would guess a degree from NUS or NTU is better right, given they have better international or regional recognition than SMU. So currently, Im thinking its either NUS or NTU but its really a tough choice. Help me!!

Confirmed: Accountacy is a professional degree, BBA/BBM is not. I must say NUS n NTU biz schools are really reputable and really at logger heads. Usually, for some or many courses, NUS triumphs NTU, but for business, NTU business school is particularly renowned in the region too...it is indeed a tough choice. One random fact though, the NUS biz sch is in a much nicer building than NTU :D I think you should try both and see which accepts you, and which gives a scholarship. :)

JKOH
11-15-2011, 02:53 PM
Ok thank you again! :D But NUS degree is a BBA. Does that one count as a professional degree? Or do you mean the NUS BBA(accountancy) is considered professional but not the BBA? Yah the NUS building nicer >< Wa tough choice. Any ideas on how different the finance modules in the 2 unis are?

teddynuts
11-15-2011, 04:02 PM
Only accountancy is professional degree. BBA/BBM or any other variation is not. :)

JKOH
11-15-2011, 05:01 PM
So I supposed NTU's accountancy would be the most viable even if I intend to do banking in the future? Thanks for all the help!

blittzz
11-16-2011, 12:31 AM
Just to add some perspectives.

Currrently I'm a smu biz student and this year I had the opportunity to attend a JP Morgan networking session where bankers from various departments of the company come to my school campus to hold a seminar there and to allow students to mingle with them over food (and wine).

When I went to the investment banking department booth there were a few bankers who were smu students a few years back. One of them is a vice-pres who has worked there for about 8 years and he provided lots of insight into the lifestyle of investment bankers. In addition, he told us that smu's investment banking specialisation in the finance major prepared him well for his job.

Considering that smu is a relatively new uni, i'm pretty surprised that a brand name bank like JP Morgan hires smu students even when it just started. This shows that it all boils down to the uni results, the activities that one participates in uni, the interview itself and individual capability at work.

a11308205
11-16-2011, 09:09 AM
hi everyone, i know this topic has been discussed to death, but after reading all the pages and seeking opinions i'm still undecided on which business school to choose.

I'm currently considering NUS biz and SMU biz, and I would very much like to work in the investment banking sector (or at least be desirable enough to get a place there if I wanted to), and I hear that SMU is great in this aspect. And perhaps it could be argued that the majority of SMU students have stellar presentation skills after 4 years in the crucible of fire which is a major plus.

However, I would also very much like to pursue a good masters program in the US, which nus currently has an advantage in terms of brand name, while i'm getting the perception that the nus biz program is many times more comprehensive than the smu equivalent for pure business content.

Are there any current students who would like to share their experiences in the respective programs or advise? thanks in advance :D

PureFitness
11-16-2011, 09:39 AM
I would very much like to work in the investment banking sector (or at least be desirable enough to get a place there if I wanted to), and I hear that SMU is great in this aspect. And perhaps it could be argued that the majority of SMU students have stellar presentation skills after 4 years in the crucible of fire which is a major plus.

Personally, I think it is just a lot of marketing on the part of SMU. The number of people entering IB from SMU isn't that much more than NUS (in terms of %). Additionally, NUS biz students have rather stellar presentation skills too. I don't see much of a diff.

However, I would also very much like to pursue a good masters program in the US, which nus currently has an advantage in terms of brand name,

If the choice is btw NUS and SMU, I'll choose NUS too because brand name does help quite a bit, especially in terms of industry partnerships and having a larger alumni base.

JKOH
11-16-2011, 04:53 PM
What about NTU??? Wouldnt a professional degree such as accountancy be better than business? Even if one have an accountancy degree, can he still choose to do banking in the future?

blittzz
11-16-2011, 06:03 PM
What about NTU??? Wouldnt a professional degree such as accountancy be better than business? Even if one have an accountancy degree, can he still choose to do banking in the future?

Yea I really think it would be best to have a professional degree like accountancy.

However if you decide to enter banking in the future such as investment banking and private banking, you may need to take additional finance mods and the workload it brings in uni to better prepare you for it.

Also, you must have a strong passion for accountancy otherwise it will be very dry for you with the ever growing number of ratios to calculate and balance sheets that never seem to be balanced in the first place. :p

JKOH
11-16-2011, 09:10 PM
Ok! :) Thank you very much! Erm, I would also like to know, whether is accounting the most direct route to be in banking as well?

What count as a professional degree? Does engineering count? Mathematics? Statistics? Because from the list of science degrees from both NUS and NTU seem to allow a specialisation in finance as well..

blittzz
11-16-2011, 10:32 PM
Ok! :) Thank you very much! Erm, I would also like to know, whether is accounting the most direct route to be in banking as well?

What count as a professional degree? Does engineering count? Mathematics? Statistics? Because from the list of science degrees from both NUS and NTU seem to allow a specialisation in finance as well..

A professional degree prepares one for a specific profession that is regulated by a government approved body. Examples are the law, accountancy, architecture, dentistry, optometry, medicine, pharmacy, nursing degree...etc

I may be wrong but I think that engineering is a general degree because there are numerous career choices in different industries for someone with an engineering degree as opposed to someone who has a professional degree like medicine.

Yea it is good that other degrees allow a specialisation in finance but that may mean taking extra modules and workload on top of what was required for that particular degree. For business degrees, one can probably specialise in finance and banking mods as part of the degree requirement w/o taking additional modules and incurring extra workload...

To be fair, it is not always bad to take additional modules or even an additional degree so long as there is passion for the subject and interest for learning even if it means graduating later and taking more exams and projects.

After all this is university where one should actively pursue academic knowledge and seek to broaden as well as deepen one's own learning and skills sets instead of curtailing learning opportunities for fear of workload and stress.

:)

blittzz
11-16-2011, 10:54 PM
is accounting the most direct route to be in banking

An accountancy degree can be the most direct route to be in banking if it is complemented with relevant finance mods. For eg. for one to enter investment banking, a business finance major grad (maybe with investment banking specialisation thrown in) stands to have a better chance at entering the industry as opposed to an accountancy grad who did not take any additional mods other than those required by the degree itself, ceteris paribus. However, if the accountancy grad also took the additional relevant finance mods then i surmise that he'll appear more appealing to employers.

However, it is still possible for most grads (even science and engineering deg grads) to enter investment banking so long as he has the right resume, the right performance at the interviews (some banks have as many as 12 interviews), the right learning and work attitude and personality, sufficient resilience and maybe the right connection with people from the inside.

Take a look at Goldman Sachs' (who always appear as the devil's advocate) CEO Lloyd Blankfein who holds a law degree. Prior to joining Goldman, he was practising tax law at a law firm. ..

Ashearo
11-18-2011, 08:32 AM
TROLOLOLNUTS

on topic, i think nus is definitely better regardless. esp if you are intending to take a masters degree overseas, the school will recognize NUS much more than NTU.

You should show some manners and address people according to their username. There is no need to change their name.

yeerk009
01-26-2012, 12:15 AM
hihi everyone, i'm currently deciding between doing accountancy between SMU or NTU.

I would especially like to know about the overseas exchange opportunities between the two different universities. Is it true that NTU, while more reputable, has a three year course which does not provide students with much time and leeway in partaking in overseas exchange than SMU or NUS?

What are the precentage of students who are offered overseas exchange opportunities in NTU as compared to SMU or NUS? (assuming they meet the GPA cutoff of course)

Thanks!

blittzz
01-27-2012, 02:56 PM
hihi everyone, i'm currently deciding between doing accountancy between SMU or NTU.

I would especially like to know about the overseas exchange opportunities between the two different universities. Is it true that NTU, while more reputable, has a three year course which does not provide students with much time and leeway in partaking in overseas exchange than SMU or NUS?

What are the precentage of students who are offered overseas exchange opportunities in NTU as compared to SMU or NUS? (assuming they meet the GPA cutoff of course)

Thanks!

For overseas exchange programme, about half of the accountancy cohort goes on exchange each year.

There is also the Accounting Study Mission that includes several pre-trip seminars led by guest speakers and instructors, followed by onsite field trips to the country/state of study. The Mission will visit some government agencies, companies and universities, as well as feature culture appreciation activities and social interactions with local professionals and students.

:)

PureFitness
01-27-2012, 09:40 PM
For overseas exchange programme, about half of the accountancy cohort goes on exchange each year.

Half? I'm kind of doubtful this sort of statistics.

Does this include people who went for summer studies and gip work and study? Because honestly, I wouldn't add these people in. If you want to get the complete experience of overseas exchange (and for it to be a real advantage on your resume), you should be going for at least one whole semester studying full-time.

And another thing that many NTU students end up very sore about is that many of their exchange programs seem to only benefit students who are rich - summer studies, GIP USA, INSTEP fee-paying.

In terms of financial assistance, GPA cut-off, variety of destinations, flexibility in having your exchange modules recognized for credits, NUS and SMU seem to give their students a much better deal.

blittzz
01-27-2012, 10:12 PM
For overseas exchange programme, about half of the accountancy cohort goes on exchange each year.

There is also the Accounting Study Mission that includes several pre-trip seminars led by guest speakers and instructors, followed by onsite field trips to the country/state of study. The Mission will visit some government agencies, companies and universities, as well as feature culture appreciation activities and social interactions with local professionals and students.

:)

Sorry I forgot to add that this is for SMU... Perhaps someone from NTU might want to shed light on their school's overseas exchange programme statistics? :p

PureFitness
01-27-2012, 10:15 PM
Sorry I forgot to add that this is for SMU... Perhaps someone from NTU might want to shed light on their school's overseas exchange programme statistics? :p

Oh sorry I blasted your post. I dunno why I assumed you were from NTU. Apologies.

If your numbers are for SMU, I think it's accurate because that's the percentage of my SMU friends who went exchange too.

blittzz
01-28-2012, 12:07 AM
Oh sorry I blasted your post. I dunno why I assumed you were from NTU. Apologies.

If your numbers are for SMU, I think it's accurate because that's the percentage of my SMU friends who went exchange too.

It's alright. No worries man ! :o

yeerk009
01-28-2012, 04:08 PM
And another thing that many NTU students end up very sore about is that many of their exchange programs seem to only benefit students who are rich - summer studies, GIP USA, INSTEP fee-paying.

In terms of financial assistance, GPA cut-off, variety of destinations, flexibility in having your exchange modules recognized for credits, NUS and SMU seem to give their students a much better deal.



Hey purefitness, it seems that you are well- versed im the way NTU operates so I must assume you are currently studying there? Well do you mind providing a rough guage or a certain statistic of the number of people who go on exchange each year at NTU ? or any additional form of info that substantiate your statement above. Thanks!

ethannn
03-09-2012, 11:57 PM
3. NUS is what most ppl have been telling me to aim for for Business. I believe NUS goes by lecture-tutorial style? And also, NUS doesn't seem to have a direct honours programme, and I"d very much want to obtain an honours year...which means if I don't perform well, I won't even be offered a chance to take up the honours year right?


lol. do your research. NUS also got seminar style lectures called sectionals. 3 hours or 4 hours straight. NUS even got adjunct staff in each class who will grade whatever you say so that you don't talk and talk with no content just for the sake of talking.

And about the direct honours... The whole idea that "honours" can so easily come EVEN BEFORE YOU START STUDYING... sounds definitely off. You are not fighting to earn the honours, at all, then. Wake up, you are entering the academic institution. you are supposed to compete for what you want, not just pick one up with no effort. And honestly, do you really think big companies will not see that, as well? sorry if i was offensive, but with that mentality of being scared to outperform others, you won't easily obtain honours in NUS. period.

ethannn
03-10-2012, 12:00 AM
plus.. all but a few classes you will take for 3 or 4 years in business faculty are all sectionals.

seeweiren
03-10-2012, 12:31 AM
You don't need a DD to get into the banking industry seriously... and if you really want to excel in the banking industry... try Quantitative Finance in SMU =).

Choose the school not because how good the school is... choose a school that prepares you well to be a better person and responsible person for the society. :)


Hi everyone!

I've some questions to ask regarding the Business/Acct courses at NTU, SMU and NUS.

I received an offer from NTU for double degree business and accountancy, haven't applied for SMU and NUS yet, but I guess I might not apply for a double degree as I'm not sure of my chances of getting them (I'm AAA/B and I understand both NUS biz and acct courses have AAA/A), so probably just a Business degree for NU?

I'll lay down some of the reasons why I'm considering each Uni and maybe you all could give some opinions/help me with some of my questions?:)

1. Do you think my chances of a double degree for SMU business and acct will be high? Because I understand there's an interview and I'm not sure if my 2nd choice (Business) will be affected if I'm rejected for my first choice (DDP).

2. I was attracted to SMU's culture/style during their open house. I've been with the lecture-tutorial style in JC and the seminar-style teachings really draw me. I'm quite soft-spoken and I actually want to 'train' myself to be outspoken, which I find SMU students to be really outspoken and confident? I believe such soft skills/presentation skills will serve me well in future? FYI, I hope to do banking/finance of the sorts in future. But what I'm unsure of is I'll actually be able to adapt to the class participation system where class part is graded as I've not tried it out before. And it might jeopardize my grades. Also, project work, I've heard stories of groupmates who aren't co-operative and it'll affect the grades.

3. NUS is what most ppl have been telling me to aim for for Business. I believe NUS goes by lecture-tutorial style? And also, NUS doesn't seem to have a direct honours programme, and I"d very much want to obtain an honours year...which means if I don't perform well, I won't even be offered a chance to take up the honours year right?

4. NTU's ddp offer with direct honours is really tempting, and yes it's established. I've been to NTU a few times, and I find NTU similar to JC or so, with so many lecture theatres, so I believe it centers on lecture-tutorial style too? Also, NTU's far for me, and I don't think I'll want to stay in the hostels.

5. Do both NTU and NUS also have seminar style classes like SMU or are they more of lecture-tutorial, with tutorials not being very interactive between students and prof/like no one usually speaks up unless to ask questions? Are students encouraged to speak up as much as SMU's students?

6. Also, what is the Singaporean/foreigner proportion like (both for students and professors for each of the 3 Unis?

In short, I like SMU's style of teaching and convenience (convenience's just an added advantage I guess since I rather go to a Uni I like than being able to reach home in <1hour each day?), I like NUS for the right balance of distance and ranking/prestige, I like NTU for the ddp since I know such ddp are really competitive and it'll open lots of career doors for me (like acct).
The courses for Business in all Unis appeal to me equally, I believe.

A very advance thanks to all:D

blittzz
03-10-2012, 01:38 PM
You don't need a DD to get into the banking industry seriously... and if you really want to excel in the banking industry... try Quantitative Finance in SMU =).

Choose the school not because how good the school is... choose a school that prepares you well to be a better person and responsible person for the society. :)

As a year 1 smu biz student going on to year 2, I would like to give my 2-cents worth.

1. I think your chances at a DDP is pretty high and so long as you perform well at the interview, you'll be able to get into the DDP of your choice. Speaking of experience where the biz course i'm taking now was my second choice, i don't think your chances at the biz course will be greatly affected even if you didn't get your DDP (touch wood).

2. Like you, I was soft-spoken as well and I dread class presentations and giving valuable inputs in jc. However, I do yearn to be able to think on my feet and give insightful inputs during discussions at the same time so I chose smu eventually.

Truth be told, almost a year into biz school (where I had 8 presentations last term), I'm still stressed by all the incoming presentations and the preparatory work needed. However, I feel so much more confident now during presentation and more inclined to give insightful inputs in class due to the quality of comments given in class by my peers (as opposed to juz class parting for the sake of it).

With regards to project work mates who are free-riders, I have encountered a few of them in these 2 terms. Initially I was angry and frustrated but ultimately (after trying to get them to contribute), I rationalised and decided to just share the accruing workload with the rest of the productive members because it contributes to my grade as well and there is no point getting upset over it.

In the working world, there are also bound to be people who are not inclined to contribute and there is a need to learn how to work around them, if not persuade them to contribute at least a little.

With regards to foreign students proportion, from the modules I have taken, I would say about 5 foreign students in a class of 40. However, the proportion also depends on the type of modules, with some modules having 8 foreign students in them.

3. Generally I would say that I quite enjoy my time in school although in the first year, not all modules appeal to me as they are mostly general university core mods. However, I expect that to change when I start to embark on modules from the major of my choice.

With regards to the length of study needed, I can expect to graduate within 3.5 years with honours in the single degree, single major course i'm taking now with taking about 4.5 - 5 modules per term.

The students in my classes are quite competitive but i would say it is still possible to maintain a good gpa so long as you are hardworking and willing to identify and improve upon the flaws which you have. I do not have the good A level grades you had but I was still able to get a gpa of at least 3.5 / 4.0 .

I would like to add that I'm rather fond of the school's office of career services because they really do tie up with many big names such as GIC, ResortWorld Sentosa, HSBC, Barclays, Goldman, JP Morgan and Procter & Gamble to have networking and recruiting sessions where management-level staff from these companies come to present what their operations are about and to spot potential talents to recruit. Emails to these sessions will be sent to everyone and I just have to register online to attend. I'm not too sure if the other unis have comparable level of service for the students.

Lastly, I wouldn't say that you should choose a school without factoring in "how good the school is" because it is always good to weigh all factors before coming to a decision that will affect you for the next 3-4 years. However, it wouldn't be wise to just base your decision on the level of recognition and length of establishment a school has because the location, the overall school culture, the curriculum and pedagogy method is equally important as well. Furthurmore, in terms of international accreditations for business and accounting schools such as AACSB and EQUIS, all three local unis are pretty on par, with smu being one of the youngest universities in the world to obtain them.

PureFitness
03-14-2012, 10:34 AM
I would like to add that I'm rather fond of the school's office of career services because they really do tie up with many big names such as GIC, ResortWorld Sentosa, HSBC, Barclays, Goldman, JP Morgan and Procter & Gamble to have networking and recruiting sessions where management-level staff from these companies come to present what their operations are about and to spot potential talents to recruit. Emails to these sessions will be sent to everyone and I just have to register online to attend. I'm not too sure if the other unis have comparable level of service for the students.

Yes for NUS... :)

You don't need a DD to get into the banking industry seriously...

yeah a first class single degree sure beats a second upper DD (all other things equal).

And also, NUS doesn't seem to have a direct honours programme, and I"d very much want to obtain an honours year...which means if I don't perform well, I won't even be offered a chance to take up the honours year right?

SMU/NTU has direct honours but you'll still have to maintain your GPA. direct honours is NOT guaranteed honours.
for SMU/NTU, if you GPA drops below the cut-off, you'll still have a normal pass degree.

mightybean
03-29-2012, 07:45 PM
Hi all,


I've applied to both NUS double degree in Business and Economics and NTU double degree in Business and Accountancy....


And right now I am torn between which is the better choice...


Many of my friends have told me to go for a professional degree like Accountancy for job security...



Can anyone help me on this??

Thank you!!

marcus
03-30-2012, 12:19 AM
Hi all,


I've applied to both NUS double degree in Business and Economics and NTU double degree in Business and Accountancy....


And right now I am torn between which is the better choice...


Many of my friends have told me to go for a professional degree like Accountancy for job security...



Can anyone help me on this??

Thank you!!


I don't think accountancy gives you a significantly higher job security, but if it helps, NUS has a double degree in accountancy+economics as well.

Since you can change programs after 1year, this factor shouldn't be a concern for you

v3ng3anc3z
03-30-2012, 08:32 AM
Simple, NUS 5 years, NTU 4 years.

The choice is obvious.

ssx
04-17-2012, 03:52 AM
Here's my experience as a year 1 NUS business student and how I made my choice.

I'll give a honest account as much as I can remember. :D

Misconceptions

My consideration is basically a fun student life. After all, this is my last phase as a student already, I simply don't want to rush into the working world. I don't really intend to work overseas, so each of these 3 universities are prestigious enough for me to gain decent employment in Singapore (if my grades are decent). They have their own strength and I wouldn't say one is superior over the others.

I shortlisted NUS and SMU initially for I was under the wrong impression that NTU crammed 4 years of programme into 3. (Remember, I want to chill) I went for the Open House, asked seniors, and eventually conclude that NUS might be a better environment since rumours and speculations are abound that SMU is very competitive due to the school trying to establish itself.

Here's some assumptions I made which I realised were false.

#1. 3 years in NTU =/= 4 years of course crammed into 3. The mainly reason why NUS takes one year more year than NTU is because to get your honours degree in NUS, you need to do a Honours Dissertation, which is something like a thesis paper. NTU does not require this as they have a direct honours system -- your grades determine your degree class.

#2. It is not only SMU that has seminar style lessons now. As of my year, unfortunately for me, (damn NS obligation), several compulsory modules have shifted from lecture-tutorial to seminar style lessons. I am not sure if there will be more to come in Year 2 but you can safely say that's the trend in NUS Business now.
Is it more competitive? Yes.
Do people get marks the rumoured way -- repeating teacher's points or rephrasing other's questions? I'd say this differ from batch to batch. For my batch, I can safely say there's little to none such people. Occasionally some seniors here and there get allocated to our module and they do that with a haughty look but he don't know we are sniggering at him behind his back. Just don't do it, you make people face palm.

#3. It's not the school, but your friends & future friends that make school fun. (The people make the culture) Most people complain that they don't make friends in university because there's no classes anymore. That's true to some extent. If your friends are going to the same school, joining them might be a good idea. However, getting out of your comfort zone isn't bad either. Nobody says you can't make new friends and keep your old friends.

That said, I don't regret coming to NUS Business School. Expected future pay is better, and yea, it's fun.

NUS

So having spent a year in NUS, I'd like to share my experience in the school.

Culture
Even though I said the people made the culture, there's really a lot more avenues to enjoy university life in NUS.

Firstly, if you are looking for a fun student life, there's hall stay, Kent Ridge or Sheares for those with diverse interest, Eusoff and Temasek for those focused on sports. The best thing is that these 4 are located within 5 to 10 minutes walking distance from NUS Business School. Staying in hall enriches your student life a lot, be it through CCA, friends, supper, events etc. Convenience can be said to be secondary. ;)

Next, there's a informal class system in NUS Business School, which is awkwardly named the Alumni Group. I believe this is unique to NUS Business but correct me if I am wrong. Basically the people in your group during your oweek business camp is your "class" for the year to come.
With the shift to seminar style teaching, and NUS Business School arranging your compulsory foundation modules for you, it turns out that you have a lot more time to interact with your "class" now. So far, undergraduates do get attached to their class, and they do projects/have fun/hang out together. It's a chance for you to form some deep friendships in NUS Business School, something most other faculties in NUS don't have.

There's also a students' club looking after the students' welfare/student life in NUS, called the NUS Bizad Club. There's similar ones in SMU and NTU, called Bondue and ABC respectively. So far, the more active ones are Bizad Club and Bondue as far as I can see from my facebook newsfeed. The Bizad Club organises several events for the students throughout the year. Apart from the camps, there's also Rag event, exam welfare, movies outing etc. Shall not comment much about this since my comments will be skewed in favour of Bizad Club.

Just one more, rag. Unique to NUS, but I don't think one should get involved unless you regard yourself as an enthusiastic person, IMHO. It's fun, but very tiring and time consuming. For more information on this, google "Rag and Flag".

Opportunities
School wouldn't serve its purpose if it's just fun and doesn't prepare you for the working world right? :p

There's pretty much a lot of opportunities to learn more about the different industry if you are willing to take out your time to register for and attend the events in your school email.

Also, there's a dedicated career office for NUS. They have nifty things going on sometimes. Recently had free wine at a Wine appreciation talk but that's not the point. I am not sure what to make of it yet. It's a mixed bag of responses. They are supposed to help you with your career though, like getting internship and stuff.

Internships wise, business career office sends a lot of emails but I can't comment since I haven't tried.

Studying Environment
So far, I consider NUS a friendly place. There's competition 'cos of the infamous bell curve but most just take it as a joke. It's not to the extent where everybody keeps their project answers to themselves. The people I know pretty much are willing to share and pretty helpful.

I'd say that the stress level is there because of the projects but the amount of stress you experience is proportionate to how much you care about your grades as conventional wisdom dictates. Of course your group matters too. Get a bunch of people that can work and you can work with and things should be fine if the tutors don't make you split up.

The stress is pretty much the same everywhere in Singapore I presume. University life ain't much easier folks. If you want it good, head over to a western country.

stagedlives
04-19-2012, 01:25 PM
Hi,

I have been offered Business from all 3 schools, and am really having a hard time deciding which one I want to accept because there are things about each of them that attracts me.

I would just like to ask, how is the school culture like in NUS Biz?

Initially I had wanted to go to SMU, but am a little put off by the fact that they don't have a hostel (I really do wanna stay in Hall), and also the fact that there are a lot of people who talk just for the sake of talking (that's what my SMU Biz friends tell me). I don't mean offense to anyone, but I would just to like to know what what I'm signing myself up for.

Are the career prospects of NUS & NTU as good as SMU's? Because I do know that SMU offers opportunities for their students to go on overseas attachments, but I'm not so sure about the other schools.

And also, are the NUS Biz classes interactive? Because SMU has their lessons in seminar style which I find effective, and am wondering whether NUS offers the same.

Thank you so much!

thisislw
04-20-2012, 05:02 PM
Hi,

I have been offered Business from all 3 schools, and am really having a hard time deciding which one I want to accept because there are things about each of them that attracts me.

I would just like to ask, how is the school culture like in NUS Biz?

Initially I had wanted to go to SMU, but am a little put off by the fact that they don't have a hostel (I really do wanna stay in Hall), and also the fact that there are a lot of people who talk just for the sake of talking (that's what my SMU Biz friends tell me). I don't mean offense to anyone, but I would just to like to know what what I'm signing myself up for.

Are the career prospects of NUS & NTU as good as SMU's? Because I do know that SMU offers opportunities for their students to go on overseas attachments, but I'm not so sure about the other schools.

And also, are the NUS Biz classes interactive? Because SMU has their lessons in seminar style which I find effective, and am wondering whether NUS offers the same.

Thank you so much!


Hi stagedlives, I'm a year 1 NUS BBA student (taking a break from exam mugging :P) and I hope I can clear some queries which you have.

SCHOOL CULTURE

SSX in the post above yours has said some things about this, you can look at his post. But just to add on,one of the things I appreciate most about NUS biz is that we have our own allocated classes which we have lessons with the whole year. Maybe SSX didn't elaborate on this, but this group of people are the ones who're going to have lunches with you, be your groupmates, have outings with you and more. I think this contributes towards the friendliness of the school population as a whole.

NUS is definitely very competitive in terms of grades, but at least for my batch we weren't competitive against each other. I.e. the competitiveness comes from the application of a bell curve on a group of people who've come into biz school with extremely high A level grades, who're hardworking and who're smart. However, we do help each other out a lot, and I've personally received a lot of help from my friends: their self-made notes, past year papers etc. So do not worry cos we generally do not cut each other's throats here. (:

SSX has touched greatly on student life. Take a lot at his post! http://forum.brightsparks.com.sg/showpost.php?p=71634&postcount=227

CAREER PROSPECTS

This is actually a very subjective issue as it really depends greatly on your grades and how your portfolio looks like. I guess how NUS differs from SMU in this area is that there is no "compulsory" attachment that we have to do. In a way I like this better as it shows your own initiative? It also allows you to do what you really like to do and explore. There is an internal portal where NUS will list all internships and it's up to your own discretion to apply for them. There're many people who complain that NUS biz doesn't give enough support career-wise but honestly I think that if you are driven enough you can enrich yourself a lot. For example, there're many free sessions every week which you can sign up for: personal-grooming, wine appreciation, public speaking, interview skills workshop. The list goes on! The problem is that most people don't sign up for them, and the same people take advantage of all these all the time. The career office also sends us daily emails regarding new internship openings. Of course, you need to ensure that your grades are good enough to get the internship of your choice.

With regards to overseas internships, I'm not really sure as I'm still in year 1. But I can say that NUS biz has many overseas exchange places to schools all over the world. More than 400 places each year just for biz faculty students, excluding places provided by NUS for the whole school. What many people do is that they extend their stay at the host country, and do an internship there. I'm sorry, I can't really help you here. ):

But one good thing about NUS is that there're only 600 biz + acc students per cohort so it really opens up many resources for you that (may) be only offered to top-performing students from other schools (like exchange:D). Of course, there's always the counter-argument that it takes a lot of hardwork to be even average in NUS as compared to larger intakes+lower cutoffs in other schools.

SEMINAR STYLE TEACHING

I'm sure many people on this forum have already talked about this. The lessons in biz are mostly in "sectional" style (NUS's own term for seminar teaching). Each sectional consists of two class (about 50 people) and lecture & tutorial are conducted at the same time. So far so good, though. Not too many people talk for the sake of talking. The tutors are emphasizing on quality talk > quantity talk and most people realise that. So over time, people learn to talk less but with more quality. (: The NUS modules seem to be conducted with great emphases on critical thinking, judging from all the rubrics we've been getting.

I hope that helped!

marcus
04-21-2012, 03:18 AM
you guys can check out my post re: NUS Biz

http://forum.brightsparks.com.sg/showthread.php?t=5140

lalasmileygirl
04-21-2012, 07:59 AM
How is the student life in NBS? Any seniors care to share? I'm seriously considering between NTU and NUS.

stagedlives
04-21-2012, 10:18 PM
Hey thisislw,

Thanks so much for your reply and information provided. It really did help to give me a clearer picture of what I'm getting myself into.

I guess what is kinda putting me off is the perception of NUS biz? Cause whenever I tell people I'm considering NUS Biz, they'll go like, "huh but NUS Biz also not very good" which is totally discouraging.

But yeah, thanks for the information, it was really helpful.

All the best for you exams!

stagedlives
04-21-2012, 10:24 PM
you guys can check out my post re: NUS Biz

http://forum.brightsparks.com.sg/showthread.php?t=5140

Wow Marcus, just read your thread and boy is it comprehensive. Thanks for taking the effort to answer FAQs that we freshies are often confused with, and would like to say that I found the thread extremely useful in helping me make my decision.

Thanks!

stagedlives
04-21-2012, 10:32 PM
What's the difference between Business Admin and Business Management?

Cause it seems as though the majors available are about the same.

sapphirestars
05-09-2012, 06:05 PM
Heyy guys, I'm in a bit of a dilemma about which local business school is better/more suitable for me. I know there's been a lot of comments on this topic but those have mostly been on the lifestyle/academic of the schools so I havent been able to find much relevant information.

I am thinking of either 1) going on to do a MBA in the US after undergraduate school OR 2) doing my freshman year locally before transferring to the US for many various reasons, so I would like to know which school will better gear me towards that? Also, what is the acceptance rates for midway transfers to US and for MBA?

I know that NUS is ranked pretty high internationally, but SMU follows the US style. Also, the requirements for some US schs for transfer is that courses are offered term by term (quarters, semesters, etc.) and that a grade is given at the end of each term. Does all our local schools fulfil that? I was leaning more towards NUS biz at first, but other prerequisites for transfers also include completing of a semester of calculus, writing/composition and introductory microeconomics, which are the foundation courses for SMU. However, I cant seem to find those under the NUS curriculum. Any thoughts/advice on those? Thank you!

ethannn
05-15-2012, 12:48 AM
There surely ARE some people who want to transfer to the states :] since first year students are assigned only 4 business modules (and you can drop some if you really really want to) and people tend to take 5-6 modules per semester, you can choose to take calculus and whatnots. If you need to fulfill microeconomics for your transfer credits, there are some pre-requisite econ courses like Managerial Economics and Macro-Econ that you are assigned (i.e. required anyway) to take within Biz faculty.

Take MA1505/MA1506 for your math credits ;] I can see that you looked into Wharton's requirements..

ethannn
05-15-2012, 01:02 AM
and whether you can get into a good MBA school really depends on your GPA (or CAP, as NUS calls it), GMAT, kickass resume (filled with working experience at industry big shot names..), but not necessarily the school name itself. So it's quite hard to tell which school is "better" in that sense. like so many people already mentioned, all 3 unis have the same accreditations and more or less the same local reputation. The only difference would be that, if you are coming from an Asian university, people are more likely to notice whether your alma mater was a flagship/"national"/or traditionally prestigious university. You think it's unfair? but that's how you would judge the quality of education of a person from some random-ass country you have not seen/heard of so much, as well.

yeosu
05-22-2012, 10:05 AM
The only difference would be that, if you are coming from an Asian university, people are more likely to notice whether your alma mater was a flagship/"national"/or traditionally prestigious university. You think it's unfair? but that's how you would judge the quality of education of a person from some random-ass country you have not seen/heard of so much, as well.

Quote for truth.

jkkk7
07-02-2012, 09:52 PM
NTU Business or NUS FASS?

After being accepted by NUS FASS and rejected by NTU Business, I was looking forward to major in Economics in FASS. (I studied business in poly).

However, the NTU letter just came and said that I am accepted into NTU Business.

Should I accept NTU Business?

JamesKoay
07-03-2012, 12:21 AM
maybe you should do business.. cause i think majoring in econs is a different game altogether.. unless you're really good at it :)

trapped
07-03-2012, 05:50 PM
NTU Business or NUS FASS?

After being accepted by NUS FASS and rejected by NTU Business, I was looking forward to major in Economics in FASS. (I studied business in poly).

However, the NTU letter just came and said that I am accepted into NTU Business.

Should I accept NTU Business?

Then again it depends on what you want to do in life later on; this is something that i just could not emphasise further.

By your choice of major in FASS and consideration of business, i assume that stable job prospects and salaries are more important to you than anything else?

In that case, you should go for NTU Biz.

Truth be told, a BA in Economics is not that attractive in the eyes of employers (especially in banking and finance) nowadays unless you have at least one of the following:
1) pursue grad school afterwards
2) tons of accomplishments (internships, leadership qualities, CCAs, excellent communication skills, etc)
3) connections

I'm not saying that business students don't need to be all-rounded or do MBA but at first sight, their qualifications would be more relevant to the financial employer at least.

But if you don't intend to go into banking and finance, then my advice wouldn't matter.

kiiyou94
05-05-2013, 01:35 AM
Hi people,

Just curious, is there any senior who is currently studying Actuarial Science in NTU biz or taking up a second major for actuarial science in SMU biz?

I've just been accepted into both NTU Business and SMU Business Management and am now in a dilemma between the two schools because I am interested in specializing in Actuarial Science and (correct me if I'm wrong) as far as i know, to study actuarial science in NTU biz, one has to do really well in certain modules in Year 1 and go thru a selection process but as for SMU biz, it is offered as a second major under the school of Econs so am i right to say that there is a higher chance of being able to take it up as a second major right? :/

And is anyone able to provide me as to what's difference in the size of one tutorial class in NTU and SMU? (hopefully it'll help me to decide betwn the courses) :)

THANKS!! ^^

Chewchun
05-25-2013, 09:41 PM
Hi.
Gonna make my decision very soon and pondering over NUS or NTU.

Honestly,after all the reading up, it seems that NUS seems to be better in terms of international prestige, internship and overseas opportunities.

IS IT TRUE?

I'm those that wanna travel as many and as far as possible and do all kinds of crazy stuff but i'm kinda in dilemma cause NUS seems to be better but my siblings are all in NTU(which mean i can get help from them).

AND ITS FREAKING SAD THAT NONE OF MY FRENZ APPLIED FOR BUSINESS.I FEEL SO LONELY.

pokkaGT
05-25-2013, 10:10 PM
"better" isn't very specific.

1. As for reputation, I can't be sure since the stories I heard are research intensive (highly academic) courses. Business is kinda non-academic. NUS has the national tag on it so I guess that counts as something :/

2. Internships opportunities are the same as NTU/SMU.

3. NUS have a greater variety of overseas exchanges. Even to universities I can't even pronounce. Anyway, NUS doesn't have exclusive relationships with top overseas universities or countries.

Bottomline: NTU and NUS is fundamentally the same.

blittzz
05-26-2013, 12:30 AM
Hi.
Gonna make my decision very soon and pondering over NUS or NTU.

Honestly,after all the reading up, it seems that NUS seems to be better in terms of international prestige, internship and overseas opportunities.

IS IT TRUE?

I'm those that wanna travel as many and as far as possible and do all kinds of crazy stuff but i'm kinda in dilemma cause NUS seems to be better but my siblings are all in NTU(which mean i can get help from them).

AND ITS FREAKING SAD THAT NONE OF MY FRENZ APPLIED FOR BUSINESS.I FEEL SO LONELY.

Hello!

I'm from SMU business.. going year 4.

Like you, i like to travel too.

My grades are average but through SMU, i managed to do the following:

1. Go Philippines on an overseas community service (20 days)
2. Go Turkey on an Accounting Study Mission (10 days)
3. Go France for exchange (reputable university)
4. Go Dubai for internship

And I went to 5 different orientation camps in year 1.

#truestory

thisislw
05-26-2013, 01:48 AM
From a very rational pov, "international prestige" can't be measured tangibly and neither can "internship opportunities", but statistically, NUS does have better overseas opportunities. Other than overseas academic trips, NUS Overseas Colleges, summer schools, dedicated foreign language programmes, (I'll stop, but you name it), NUS biz has over 400 overseas exchange places for its students per year (which we're all very thankful for!).


Hi.
Gonna make my decision very soon and pondering over NUS or NTU.

Honestly,after all the reading up, it seems that NUS seems to be better in terms of international prestige, internship and overseas opportunities.

IS IT TRUE?

I'm those that wanna travel as many and as far as possible and do all kinds of crazy stuff but i'm kinda in dilemma cause NUS seems to be better but my siblings are all in NTU(which mean i can get help from them).

AND ITS FREAKING SAD THAT NONE OF MY FRENZ APPLIED FOR BUSINESS.I FEEL SO LONELY.