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thetourist
03-18-2009, 11:52 AM
Hi to all,

Is anyone familiar with the prospects of during a BBA in a local U...thx!

spencer
03-23-2009, 09:43 AM
Hi to all,

Is anyone familiar with the prospects of during a BBA in a local U...thx!

Mistake like this on a cover letter will get you a straight rejection. No prospects.

yanshuo
03-23-2009, 10:53 AM
Mistake like this on a cover letter will get you a straight rejection. No prospects.

There is no need to be so harsh. He was asking about the prospects of a BBA in general, not about his own prospects.

spencer
03-25-2009, 06:57 AM
There is no need to be so harsh. He was asking about the prospects of a BBA in general, not about his own prospects.

Just speaking the truth.

815
05-13-2009, 03:20 PM
What can i do with a BBA from NUS? or a BBA from any uni locally? thks.
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spencer
05-22-2009, 02:06 AM
What can i do with a BBA from NUS? or a BBA from any uni locally? thks.

You can do jobs that don't require a specific degree.

It's more advisable to do professional degrees like accounting, engineering, etc. Failing that, do something that you cannot pick up later in your life. For ex, you probably can learn about management on your own, but you probably would be able to learn about engineering maths on your own.

sonrocker
05-22-2009, 03:52 PM
Talking abt professional degree, may i ask if a degree in maths/ physics / chemistry / econs /psychology etc considered a professional degree?
Wanna hear an opinion. Thanks

spencer
05-23-2009, 01:40 AM
Talking abt professional degree, may i ask if a degree in maths/ physics / chemistry / econs /psychology etc considered a professional degree?
Wanna hear an opinion. Thanks

They are not professional; maths and chemistry would be very good foundation degrees for higher degrees.

Avoid Psychology.

cleanerdung
05-23-2009, 01:16 PM
They are not professional; maths and chemistry would be very good foundation degrees for higher degrees.

Avoid Psychology.

just do whatever you are interested in, even psychology. important thing is to do well in it. what is the use of going into accounting / engineering if you are just going to end up flunking or scraping through?

no point doing a professional degree just for the sake of it... typical singaporean mentality to define a good education in such narrow terms. that is bad advice which might just cause needless years of pain.

spencer
05-24-2009, 09:52 PM
just do whatever you are interested in, even psychology. important thing is to do well in it. what is the use of going into accounting / engineering if you are just going to end up flunking or scraping through?

no point doing a professional degree just for the sake of it... typical singaporean mentality to define a good education in such narrow terms. that is bad advice which might just cause needless years of pain.

With the exception that I'm not a Singaporean.

sonrocker
05-25-2009, 08:43 AM
Alright alright, chill yea. Thanks for offering ur views.
Btw spencer i'm just wondering if a degree in NTU maths&econs will provide a good preparation for a career in finance-related field?

cleanerdung
05-25-2009, 10:47 AM
With the exception that I'm not a Singaporean.

errr ok... so now you don't even have an excuse for being so utilitarian ;)

sonrocker: many math & econs grads go into finance (at least prior to the recession) because of their strong quantitative foundation. however, I'm not sure whether the NTU degree will be viewed as favourably as graduates from established math & econs programmes at foreign universities.

sonrocker
05-25-2009, 10:55 AM
sonrocker: many math & econs grads go into finance (at least prior to the recession) because of their strong quantitative foundation. however, I'm not sure whether the NTU degree will be viewed as favourably as graduates from established math & econs programmes at foreign universities.

U've answered my qn. Thanks

spencer
05-25-2009, 10:48 PM
Alright alright, chill yea. Thanks for offering ur views.
Btw spencer i'm just wondering if a degree in NTU maths&econs will provide a good preparation for a career in finance-related field?

Recruiters will bin your CV due to the NTU name. For getting into finance, the university is more important than the course. You can almost certainly get into finance if you read just about any course in Harvard.

pearl
05-25-2009, 11:58 PM
They are not professional; maths and chemistry would be very good foundation degrees for higher degrees.

Avoid Psychology.

Mind explaining why avoid psychology ?

spencer
05-26-2009, 02:13 AM
Mind explaining why avoid psychology ?

what a silly question

pearl
05-26-2009, 02:39 AM
what a silly question

A simple yes would have sufficed if you did not want to explain.

cleanerdung
05-26-2009, 08:41 AM
what a silly question

an expected response from someone who disregards the value of an education in the social sciences.

sonrocker
05-26-2009, 08:49 AM
Recruiters will bin your CV due to the NTU name. For getting into finance, the university is more important than the course. You can almost certainly get into finance if you read just about any course in Harvard.

Ur reply makes me wonder why the university is more important than the course U mean they dun care what u specialise in and just anyhow offer u a place just because u are from the top school, regardless of whether u can perform? How true is this in the singapore market, to say the least? U are speaking from experience i guess? [ from the perspective of a recruiter or a job-seeker ]
Awaiting ur reply.

P.S: Talking abt binning CVs, if u have 3 candidates in hands [ 1 nus, 1 ntu, 1 smu ], assuming the course they took doesnt matter, which one would u pick just for a finance job?

anorchard
05-26-2009, 01:17 PM
Ur reply makes me wonder why the university is more important than the course U mean they dun care what u specialise in and just anyhow offer u a place just because u are from the top school, regardless of whether u can perform? How true is this in the singapore market, to say the least? U are speaking from experience i guess? [ from the perspective of a recruiter or a job-seeker ]
Awaiting ur reply.

P.S: Talking abt binning CVs, if u have 3 candidates in hands [ 1 nus, 1 ntu, 1 smu ], assuming the course they took doesnt matter, which one would u pick just for a finance job?

let's put it in a little perspective. the university name matters much, of course, but i would separate schools that allow you to get into entry-level, front office finance positions into 2 broad categories.

1) globally renowned schools - your harvards, oxfords, whartons et al. these are the schools which will allow you to be globally mobile in your first job. i.e you will be a competitive applicant in the us/europe/asia as long as your grades are sound. the major isn't that important, because most of what you do in finance is learnt on the job anyway. i can safely say i use maybe 20-30% of what i learned formally in my current position. so you get in by virtue of going to a good school, by being well liked by alumni at the firm, and by just basically having your wits about you. it may be unfair, but that's the way it is.

2) regionally renowned schools - now, these schools may not give you as great an opportunity to move to other regions (again, in your first position), but they do give you an opportunity to work in finance in the region you are located. i would put the three local unis here. while cvs from these schools may be binned in london or the us, they are perfectly acceptable in most of asia. i know because i have plenty of friends who graduated from these schools and are now in finance - my local markets fx trading team is almost exclusively made up of NUS graduates (although they are much older - times have changed since). granted, the criteria is more stringent: good grades, relevant or at least quantitative coursework etc. AND, they are probably the 2nd option to #1.

i can probably elucidate further, but i think this description should suffice. i do stress that this is a rough generalization though. i realize that there are outliers, but those should be the exception rather than the rule. as for your other question, i can probably shed some light - i was trying to hire a graduate intern recently and did look at fresh grads from the 3 local schools, in addition to a few other unis. i can honestly say then that i don't think that the school name really matters - the quality of the candidate is much more important. the course of study isn't really critical as well so long as the person is well prepared for the interview. and i think most interviewers will say the same thing

spencer
05-27-2009, 06:55 AM
Ur reply makes me wonder why the university is more important than the course U mean they dun care what u specialise in and just anyhow offer u a place just because u are from the top school, regardless of whether u can perform? How true is this in the singapore market, to say the least? U are speaking from experience i guess? [ from the perspective of a recruiter or a job-seeker ]
Awaiting ur reply.

P.S: Talking abt binning CVs, if u have 3 candidates in hands [ 1 nus, 1 ntu, 1 smu ], assuming the course they took doesnt matter, which one would u pick just for a finance job?

NUS NTU and SMU (and HKU, HKUST, etc) are ~ the same, all Singapore based local universities.

If you have NUS, SMU and UPenn competing for a job in Singapore based investment banking dept, I can almost certainly confirm that the candidate from UPenn will get the offer, baring exceptional circumstances.

If you are from a top school that means you are very smart. They can teach you the rest.

jellybean
05-27-2009, 11:55 AM
NUS NTU and SMU (and HKU, HKUST, etc) are ~ the same, all Singapore based local universities.

If you have NUS, SMU and UPenn competing for a job in Singapore based investment banking dept, I can almost certainly confirm that the candidate from UPenn will get the offer, baring exceptional circumstances.

If you are from a top school that means you are very smart. They can teach you the rest.
Let's say there's a finance company (e.g. bank) looking for a worker to do a finance job. They have 2 potential employees to choose from: NUS BBA graduate with a major in finance and Harvard grad who majored in psychology (sidenote: you have an issue with this subject?). So in your opinion, the bank will employ the harvard grad who knows nuts about finance instead of the NUS grad who already has the basic relevant knowledge about finance which will reduce the need for training?

And I'm also curious on your take on sonrocker's question "if u have 3 candidates in hands [ 1 nus, 1 ntu, 1 smu ], assuming the course they took doesnt matter, which one would u pick just for a finance job?". I believe your response, "If you have NUS, SMU and UPenn competing for a job in Singapore..." was not in context of his question.

spencer
05-28-2009, 11:41 AM
Let's say there's a finance company (e.g. bank) looking for a worker to do a finance job. They have 2 potential employees to choose from: NUS BBA graduate with a major in finance and Harvard grad who majored in psychology (sidenote: you have an issue with this subject?). So in your opinion, the bank will employ the harvard grad who knows nuts about finance instead of the NUS grad who already has the basic relevant knowledge about finance which will reduce the need for training?

And I'm also curious on your take on sonrocker's question "if u have 3 candidates in hands [ 1 nus, 1 ntu, 1 smu ], assuming the course they took doesnt matter, which one would u pick just for a finance job?". I believe your response, "If you have NUS, SMU and UPenn competing for a job in Singapore..." was not in context of his question.

The Harvard psychology student will be taken with absolute certainty (for the bank job).

NUS, NTU and SMU students are basically equal for positions in Asia. The fear for NTU and SMU students is that their CVs will get binned before they got a look.

What you learn about finance in university is a joke. How much securitisation can you really learn in university? Not even in a master course can you become useful!

sonrocker
05-28-2009, 01:33 PM
The Harvard psychology student will be taken with absolute certainty (for the bank job).
=> Well, that might be true. This is what i infer from ur replies: as long as one is smart [u think his intelligence is solely reflected by his school name ??], he can be taught to do a finance job as most of the knowledge comes from on-the-job training. Am i right to say that?

NUS, NTU and SMU students are basically equal for positions in Asia. The fear for NTU and SMU students is that their CVs will get binned before they got a look.

=> Somehow i feel the 2nd sentence raises inconsistency in the idea because if all 3 are equally positioned, why only NTU n SMU CVs get binned ? Are u saying that all NUS students are superior/smarter than their NTU, SMU counterparts? I really wonder how true.

Just my 2 cents. Thanks.

yanshuo
05-28-2009, 02:27 PM
The Harvard psychology student will be taken with absolute certainty (for the bank job).

NUS, NTU and SMU students are basically equal for positions in Asia. The fear for NTU and SMU students is that their CVs will get binned before they got a look.

What you learn about finance in university is a joke. How much securitisation can you really learn in university? Not even in a master course can you become useful!

On this point, I think spencer is right. Although I have no first-hand information from high-powered recruiters, I have read a number of management books which basically say that certain qualities (talents) are innate but others (skills and knowledge) can be trained. Therefore, for general positions, a recruiter should always choose a candidate based on his talents rather than his skills.

Maybe it is too extreme to say that the Harvard grad will be chosen over the NUS grad every single time, but we can't avoid the fact that Harvard graduates are generally analytically smarter and faster learners than their NUS counterparts. As mentioned above, these talents take priority over skills or knowledge, which can roughly be equated with the course of study.

cleanerdung
05-28-2009, 04:17 PM
I'm very curious as to how many JC grads there are out there who are actually seriously contemplating between Harvard psych (or an equivalent social science course at a TOP top uni) and NUS finance (or other local business course).

I can imagine someone choosing between Rice and NUS (like one of the forummers), but Harvard vs NUS?? Save for financial reasons, it seems like a no-brainer to me. Even then I would have thought a Singaporean who is Harvard material should be able to get finaid/scholarships from whatever source.

Having said that... I wonder what is the point of asking about employer preference when you can't change the fact about which group you belong in.

Besides, I'm very amused at how the topic always goes back to finance. Why doesn't anyone care about the employment practices outside of finance? Because from my experience, employers aren't that hard up about "brand name degrees" in other industries.

sonrocker
05-28-2009, 04:42 PM
Besides, I'm very amused at how the topic always goes back to finance.

Hi, it's probably because this thread is about career in business, accountancy & Finance

I'm not sure what's happening in other industries though but for finance-related job, I can alr see it's quite tough.

jellybean
05-28-2009, 05:37 PM
I wonder what is the point of asking about employer preference when you can't change the fact about which group you belong in.

The point is this: To satisfy my curiosity.

I know a NUS student will definitely lose out to a Harvard student because of the university branding. Its a fact I wont deny. But what I did not expect was that employers will give total disregard (according to spencer) to course of study and whether or not it is relevant to the job scope when viewing the CV of a NUS and Harvard student. Yes I can't change the fact about which group I'm in, but what I can change is my attitude, perception and expectations towards my job-seeking process in future.

What point did I gain from asking that qn and reading people's views? A new insight I previously did not have. And curiosity satisfied.

spencer
05-28-2009, 08:27 PM
The Harvard psychology student will be taken with absolute certainty (for the bank job).
=> Well, that might be true. This is what i infer from ur replies: as long as one is smart [u think his intelligence is solely reflected by his school name ??], he can be taught to do a finance job as most of the knowledge comes from on-the-job training. Am i right to say that?

NUS, NTU and SMU students are basically equal for positions in Asia. The fear for NTU and SMU students is that their CVs will get binned before they got a look.

=> Somehow i feel the 2nd sentence raises inconsistency in the idea because if all 3 are equally positioned, why only NTU n SMU CVs get binned ? Are u saying that all NUS students are superior/smarter than their NTU, SMU counterparts? I really wonder how true.

Just my 2 cents. Thanks.

If you need to look for the best and brightest in Japan, isn't University of Tokyo a logical place to start?

spencer
05-28-2009, 08:38 PM
The point is this: To satisfy my curiosity.

I know a NUS student will definitely lose out to a Harvard student because of the university branding. Its a fact I wont deny. But what I did not expect was that employers will give total disregard (according to spencer) to course of study and whether or not it is relevant to the job scope when viewing the CV of a NUS and Harvard student. Yes I can't change the fact about which group I'm in, but what I can change is my attitude, perception and expectations towards my job-seeking process in future.

What point did I gain from asking that qn and reading people's views? A new insight I previously did not have. And curiosity satisfied.

For finance recruitment there's list of "target" universities. Obviously, American universities (like Ivies, eg Dartmouth) populate the list for NY office. For London, it is populated by the top European (British included) universities. For AXJ recruiting, I'm sorry to say that because none of the NAJ universities are well developed, the target list seems to be American and anglo-saxon universities.

Logically, if you are Asian, can speak Chinese and want to get ahead, the best thing you can do right now is to get a degree from elite Chinese universities. The only direction for their prestige is up and you can bet that Asia (including Australia and New Zealand) will get China centric in no time.

cleanerdung
05-29-2009, 09:31 AM
it is a fact that there are several companies which turn up at NUS career fair only and give recruitment talks at NUS only (and no, they are not recruiting for law/medicine or any other undergrad disciplines that is only available at NUS). sure, it might be just out of convenience but it might give you an indication of their preferences (or the fact that NUS has a larger number of alumni in the industry which can influence such decisions?).

williamparkar
04-03-2010, 02:32 PM
They are not professional; maths and chemistry would be very good foundation degrees for higher degrees. And Ya Avoid Psychology. ..

Mod Haecceity Edit: Link Removed. Please note that no advertising is allowed.

jane
09-19-2010, 10:38 PM
I am interested in a job as a financial controller or analyst in the banking sector and hope to seek some advice from you. (:

I am currently offered the choice of double degrees in business and Accountancy, or a double major programme in business (specialise in finance) and economics.

The difference between a double degree and double major is that a double degree will have another degree scroll, while the double major will only be a reflection in my transcripts.

Personally, I have more interest for economics. I believe the macroeconomics perspectives will help me a lot as an analyst. However, my family have advised me to take up accountancy, as it is more "practical", and will be more relevant should I decide to be a financial controller.

May I know what are the industry requirements for both careers, and which of the 2 choices do you think will have more career opportunities, and perhaps more sought after when i apply for grad school?

Thanks in advance (:

gggeh
03-22-2011, 12:34 AM
Hey I would like to know also is it true accountancy is more practical than econs?

Also is econs more practical than business or is it the other way around?

Thanks!